TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by deathonacracker » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:01 pm

iwh wrote:
deathonacracker wrote:
iwh wrote:I know that head lice live in the hair, but don't human body lice live in clothing and not actually on the body?

Surely it was the clothing that would have needed any delousing and not the person?
Yes, true, I looked up body lice and they were speaking about clothes. Naturally Zyklon-B in heavy amounts was used to kill lice and smaller amounts for humans. Seems we are not as tough as those bugs. :D
So providing mass showers to people would have actually served little real use in regards to delousing.

As far as I know, there is no account of Zyklon B being used at any of the AR camps to delouse clothing.

If the AR camps were used to delouse Jews "going East", then logic would have it that the same camps could be used to delouse troops heading West in 1942/43 after their time on the front line.

Is there any evidence of this?
Good question. I'm waiting for the Sara Berg book to arrive. SM might know.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Cerdic » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:34 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:CULT MEMBERS! THIS HAS BEEN A BAD YEAR FOR HOLOCAUST DENIERS. MARK WEBER AND DAVID IRVING ACTUALLY LOOKED AT THE REAL EVIDENCE AND LEFT THE CULT. DAVID STEIN TOLD EVERYONE WE ARE REALLY STUPID. BRADLEY SMITH IS IN TEARS BECAUSE SOME ASKED HIM TO SHOW WHERE OUR DONATIONS TO HIM WENT. EVEN WORSE OUR CULT DEMANDED ANOTHER EXCAVATION OF TREBLINKA AND STAFFORDSHIRE UNIVERSITY DID THIS AND FOUND THE GAS CHAMBERS AND EVEN MORE MASS BURIAL PITS.

We have a big problem here how to deal with the fallout. We need to break the remaining cult members into four groups,

1) The elite holocaust deniers who make money from donations from other deniers
2) Those deniers who have enough money to keep making donations
3) The really stupid deniers who can keep the cult going so donations keep flowing
4) The really really stupid deniers who simply prop up furniture & act as paper weights.

It is the duty of every stupid denier in category three to do the following

Confidentiality
a) Never question where the donations are going
b) Never question why leading pro-American deniers like David Duke live in Austria (to avoid tax)
c) Never mention that leading deniers like Graf live in Iran and work for the Iranian government's political propaganda unit, the IPIS.

Promoting Strawmen
d) Always attack historians for talking about "jewish baby bonfires" even though historians never mention them.
e) Always compare the Nazi genocide to anything unrelated to change the topic
f) Discuss "freedom of speech" while pretending the Nazis didn't burn books on mass

Avoid answering direct Questions
g) Never answer a direct question. Always scream "Believer!" and write about steam chambers and baby bonfires instead.
h) If a direct question has to be answered, make up a complete lie and never provide a citation.

Water off a Duck's back
i) When you have been caught directly lying and fabricating evidence, simply stop posting in that thread and start another thread on exactly the same topic and repeat the lies.

Spreading Propaganda
j) When another holocaust denier produces a propaganda video, immediately link that video to every website possible, but never watch the video yourself.
k) When historians points out errors in the video ( no water for showers) (Treblinka C.O's confessed and described operations) simply ignore this information as it is a propaganda video and not an explanation..

THIS WILL SAVE THE CULT. THESE TECHNIQUES HAVE WORKED VERY WELL FOR THE FLAT EARTH SOCIETY AND IT STILL HAS OVER 30 MEMBERS NOT IN INVOLUNTARY MENTAL CARE!

THIS ORDER ISSUED by
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad ( Iranian IPIS), and
Category One deniers (who are still receiving donations)
This gave me a good laugh, Matthew, thanks ;)

Hunt, are you really trying the steam chamber story again? This was already debunked by SM and myself on RODOH.
„(...) Wenn wir irgendetwas beim Nationalsozialismus anerkennen, dann ist es die Anerkennung, daß ihm zum ersten Mal in der deutschen Politik die restlose Mobilisierung der menschlichen Dummheit gelungen ist.“ Kurt Schumacher 23. Februar 1932

Vote Your Conscience.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:35 pm

scrmbldggs wrote:One can't compare Flossenburg to Treblinka.

ETA http://www.gedenkstaette-flossenbuerg.d ... e/RSGB.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Of course one can. I just did. Even Rosenberg himself, who was in both camps compared them. They're in the same camp system so of course they can be compared. I'm saying the alleged steam room Rosenberg was in at Treblinka served a similar purpose to the shower Rosenberg experienced at Flossenberg. That steam room was the fraudulently alleged homocidal steam chambers with terra cotta floors, which later became diesel gas chambers.

Plus I don't acknowledge that Treblinka was an incomparable hell-on-earth "pure extermination camp" but a Transit camp so of course I can compare it to other transit camps or labor camps throughout the camp system that Rosenberg himself went through, had similar set-ups throughout, and compared.

Next.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:39 pm

scrmbldggs wrote:It also would seem well-advised to rely on the words of those who lived during that time and were well informed.l
You're right, that's why I rely on the November 1942 report on the steam room complex that is know proven to be accurate due to the recent discovery of the terra cotta floors which corroborate claims about the steam room complex's appearance, structure, and purpose.

Only the claim that this was a deadly steam room is inaccurate, not backed up by any evidence, and is in fact proven to be a non-lethal steam room by witnesses such as Rosenberg.

You can also "rely" on the testimony of the Jews which, corroborated by the evidence also prove this was a transit camp.

Next.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:48 pm

iwh wrote:
deathonacracker wrote:
iwh wrote:I know that head lice live in the hair, but don't human body lice live in clothing and not actually on the body?

Surely it was the clothing that would have needed any delousing and not the person?
Yes, true, I looked up body lice and they were speaking about clothes. Naturally Zyklon-B in heavy amounts was used to kill lice and smaller amounts for humans. Seems we are not as tough as those bugs. :D
So providing mass showers to people would have actually served little real use in regards to delousing.

Good luck arguing that. What did you look up - be honest - wikipedia? .

Most of the concentration camps and even prisons today have a mandatory intake system that involves showers. You can see the Ellis Island footage where they do the same thing in America where mass amounts of immigrants were being processed.

If you're arguing that the Nazi camps didn't have an intake system that involved showering, good luck with that. You really may have to stretch that far to maintain your theology of 6 million and gas chambers.

Flossenberg - Heinz Rosenberg describing intake
"Suddenly, the water came out of the shower heads, but it was boiling, hot water. We could not even escape to a corner of the room. We jumped like frogs, cursed and tried to protect ourselves against the steaming element. It was impossible. After five minutes, the shower hall was filled with steam and lobster-like, red-looking men. The door was opened and we ran out into the fresh air, regardless of the wind or weather, but only to get relief from our own burning skin."
Obviously it was thought that showering them before putting them into clean deloused clothes could remove or kill disease and disease carrying pests.
Last edited by gaschamberhoax on Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:52 pm

Cerdic wrote: Hunt, are you really trying the steam chamber story again? This was already debunked by SM and myself on RODOH.
You haven't debunked a thing and are using your old canned responses, Colls and Rosenberg provide new evidence, as well as myself.

The November 1942 report describes specifically the terra cotta floors in addition the the well location and the use of the building - putting hot water on inmates (falsely claimed to the point of death).

Heinz Rosenberg describes being inside a non-lethal steam room at Treblinka on intake.

The building claimed to be a gas chamber was a steam room or hot shower such as the kind Rosenberg describes (both at Treblinka and the one at Flossenberg).

It was not a diesel gas chamber and the Nov 1942 report that was so specific to pick up on the terra cotta floors wouldn't have misidentified the murder weapon and replaced it with the same terra-cotta specific details describing a steam room, connected to "chambers" connected to the well in the same location.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by deathonacracker » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:57 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:One can't compare Flossenburg to Treblinka.

ETA http://www.gedenkstaette-flossenbuerg.d ... e/RSGB.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Of course one can. I just did. Even Rosenberg himself, who was in both camps compared them. They're in the same camp system so of course they can be compared. I'm saying the alleged steam room Rosenberg was in at Treblinka served a similar purpose to the shower Rosenberg experienced at Flossenberg. That steam room was the fraudulently alleged homocidal steam chambers with terra cotta floors, which later became diesel gas chambers.

Plus I don't acknowledge that Treblinka was an incomparable hell-on-earth "pure extermination camp" but a Transit camp so of course I can compare it to other transit camps or labor camps throughout the camp system that Rosenberg himself went through, had similar set-ups throughout, and compared.

Next.
Which part of you got the wrong Rosenberg did you miss?

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:21 pm

Eliahu Rosenberg:
Eliahu Rosenberg
Testimony about Treblinka at the Eichmann Trial 1961
(Selected Extracts)
http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... imony.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Sam Rosenberg:
She met Sam Rosenberg there, after he had escaped death at Flossenburg concentration camp.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2006 ... brick-oven" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by deathonacracker » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:27 pm

scrmbldggs wrote:Eliahu Rosenberg:
Eliahu Rosenberg
Testimony about Treblinka at the Eichmann Trial 1961
(Selected Extracts)
http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... imony.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Sam Rosenberg:
She met Sam Rosenberg there, after he had escaped death at Flossenburg concentration camp.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2006 ... brick-oven" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Didn't mean to mix you up with a different post. Oops. Sorry.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:33 pm

deathonacracker wrote:
Which part of you got the wrong Rosenberg did you miss?
He somehow ascribed a conspiracy theory involving me using the (wrong) Walter Rosenberg to who I'm talking about, and is featured in the video, and so do you.

http://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/irn509193" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Henry Roberston (né Heinz Rosenberg), born September 15, 1921,


Or maybe you think I'm REALLY talking about Julius and Ethel Rosenberg therefore I'm a liar?

What do you expect with someone who has been arguing for days thinking we're referring to Lanzmann's Shoah and not Spielberg's Shoah foundation?

Which part of that did you miss?

Did you find out how showers work? It's not Nazi magic.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:47 pm

Interviewee Heinz Rosenberg
Gender M
Birth Year 1921
Birth City Göttingen (Hannover/ Prussia/ Germany)
Birth Country Germany
Ghettos Minsk (Belorussia/ USSR : Ghetto)
Camps Budzyn (Poland : Concentration Camp)
Wieliczka (Poland : Concentration Camp)
Wesserling (France : Concentration Camp)
Flossenbürg (Germany : Concentration Camp)
Reichshof-PZL (Poland : Concentration Camp)
Bergen-Belsen (Germany : Concentration Camp)
Krakau-Plaszow (Poland : Concentration Camp)
Sachsenhausen (Germany : Concentration Camp)
Bremen (Germany : Concentration Camp)(generic)
Treblinka (Poland : Concentration Camp)(generic)
Minsk - Telefunken (Belorussia/ USSR : Concentration Camp)
Location of Liberation Bergen-Belsen (Germany : Concentration Camp)
http://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/vha7452" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Please tell us more about Mr. Heinz Rosenberg. He seems like a very interesting person.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:50 pm

Sure. He apparently started in Germany and was sent East to Minsk. Then he was sent back and shipped to all sorts of camps on the way back west, including on the way Treblinka.

He and some close friends and relatives were transited through Treblinka and frequently were separated at camps along the way and then reunited, alive of course.

It's easier for some to say the Jews who they couldn't or prefer not to find again were killed at Treblinka - like the below link where Rosenberg was claimed "never heard from again". But they had complex existences, such as Rosenberg's. We all can "hear from him again" and ALL those claimed disappeared if we throw away the gassing lie and trace where these "disappeared" Jews really went.
Matthew Ellard wrote:[Heinz Rosenberg was taken to the Treblinka extermination camp in September 1943 and never heard from again.
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cg ... d=86721379" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Wed Mar 12, 2014 6:03 pm

^Thank you, gaschamberhoax.



___________________________________________________
deathonacracker wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:Eliahu Rosenberg:
Eliahu Rosenberg
Testimony about Treblinka at the Eichmann Trial 1961
(Selected Extracts)
http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... imony.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Sam Rosenberg:
She met Sam Rosenberg there, after he had escaped death at Flossenburg concentration camp.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2006 ... brick-oven" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Didn't mean to mix you up with a different post. Oops. Sorry.
:lol:

Let me apologize beforehand for when I'm doing similar. It can be quite messy and hard to keep track around here. ;)
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by iwh » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:00 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:
Good luck arguing that. What did you look up - be honest - wikipedia? .
Luck doesn't come into it. The human body lice lives in clothing. It only uses the body to feed on. Perhaps you might like to try these links:

http://medent.usyd.edu.au/fact/bodylice.html

http://www.dermnetnz.org/arthropods/bodylice.html

The biggest problem in delousing is not the body, it is the clothing. So where were the tons of clothing deloused at the AR camps?
Most of the concentration camps and even prisons today have a mandatory intake system that involves showers. You can see the Ellis Island footage where they do the same thing in America where mass amounts of immigrants were being processed.
But according to deniers, the AR camps were transit camps. According to your logic, it would have been better to delouse and wash at the destination and not half way through the journey.
If you're arguing that the Nazi camps didn't have an intake system that involved showering, good luck with that.


I'm not.
Obviously it was thought that showering them before putting them into clean deloused clothes could remove or kill disease and disease carrying pests.
What clean deloused clothes? Where were they deloused? How were they deloused?
For a debunking of new boy on the block John Wear see:

https://wearswarts.wordpress.com

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Nessie » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:00 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:It also would seem well-advised to rely on the words of those who lived during that time and were well informed.l
You're right, that's why I rely on the November 1942 report on the steam room complex that is know proven to be accurate due to the recent discovery of the terra cotta floors which corroborate claims about the steam room complex's appearance, structure, and purpose.

Only the claim that this was a deadly steam room is inaccurate, not backed up by any evidence, and is in fact proven to be a non-lethal steam room by witnesses such as Rosenberg.

You can also "rely" on the testimony of the Jews which, corroborated by the evidence also prove this was a transit camp.

Next.
Where did the water come from for the supposed steam room to function?

Why are tiles only an indication of a steam room and not a gas chamber?
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Nessie » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:03 pm

iwh wrote:.....

What clean deloused clothes? Where were they deloused? How were they deloused?
Plus, how were the trains cleaned? What is the point in a dirty carriage, clean the people and put them back into the dirty carriage?
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by iwh » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:08 pm

Nessie wrote:
iwh wrote:.....

What clean deloused clothes? Where were they deloused? How were they deloused?
Plus, how were the trains cleaned? What is the point in a dirty carriage, clean the people and put them back into the dirty carriage?
Good point sir. Is there any evidence of trains being cleaned? Is there any evidence of clothes being distributed?

As I said earlier, was it only Jews deloused there? What about all those non Jewish labourers from the East going to work in Germany? What about all those troops returning from the front?

Why delouse halfway through a journey?

It makes no sense.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:09 pm

Nessie wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:It also would seem well-advised to rely on the words of those who lived during that time and were well informed.l
You're right, that's why I rely on the November 1942 report on the steam room complex that is know proven to be accurate due to the recent discovery of the terra cotta floors which corroborate claims about the steam room complex's appearance, structure, and purpose.

Only the claim that this was a deadly steam room is inaccurate, not backed up by any evidence, and is in fact proven to be a non-lethal steam room by witnesses such as Rosenberg.

You can also "rely" on the testimony of the Jews which, corroborated by the evidence also prove this was a transit camp.

Next.
Where did the water come from for the supposed steam room to function?

Why are tiles only an indication of a steam room and not a gas chamber?

A path (9) skirts the building and runs along its western wall finally ending at the next building (12) near death-house No. 1 (14). This building is at right-angles to the death-house No. 2. It is a brick construction much smaller than the other. It consists of only three chambers and a steam-room. Along the northern wall of this house runs a corridor from which there are doors to the chambers. The outside walls of the chambers have valves (until recently doors which had been changed into valves for utility reasons). Also here a scoop in the shape of a shallow vessel is placed at the height of the valves (15). The steam-room (15a) is adjacent to the building. Inside the steam-room there is a large vat which produces the steam. The hot steam comes in to the chambers through pipes installed there, each having a prescribed number of vents. While this machinery of death is in action, the doors and valves are hermetically closed. The floor in the chambers has a terra-cotta inlay which becomes very slippery when water is poured over it. There is a well next to the steam-room, the only well in the whole area of Treblinka B.

http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/t/3.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Skeptical about wells and showers but not diesel gas chambers and 1 million non-existent remains. W-w-w-WHAT?

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:14 pm

iwh wrote:
Nessie wrote:
iwh wrote:.....

What clean deloused clothes? Where were they deloused? How were they deloused?
Plus, how were the trains cleaned? What is the point in a dirty carriage, clean the people and put them back into the dirty carriage?
Good point sir. Is there any evidence of trains being cleaned? Is there any evidence of clothes being distributed?

As I said earlier, was it only Jews deloused there? What about all those non Jewish labourers from the East going to work in Germany? What about all those troops returning from the front?

Why delouse halfway through a journey?

It makes no sense.
Whoever asks for evidence of trains being cleaned or clothes being distributed didn't watch the video, no further point commenting on that.

One of operation Reinhard's purposes was possession / wealth extraction, some claim it was named after the head of the finance ministry.
Why delouse halfway through a journey?
You're claiming transit camps didn't exist? I also don't claim everyone "fully" deloused, there's not evidence for everyone fully delousing and some transitees don't mention taking showers.

If you want to talk about things that REALLY don't make sense, talk about diesel exhaust being used by the EPA in human tests, some sucking on it for 2 hours at a time.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by iwh » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:32 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:
Whoever asks for evidence of trains being cleaned or clothes being distributed didn't watch the video, no further point commenting on that.
Why not?

BTW...I don't get my history from home made videos.
One of operation Reinhard's purposes was possession / wealth extraction, some claim it was named after the head of the finance ministry.
...and your point is sir?
You're claiming transit camps didn't exist?


Not at the AR camps. Please stay on task.
I also don't claim everyone "fully" deloused, there's not evidence for everyone fully delousing and some transitees don't mention taking showers.
So why take a shower only to put the old clothes back on? What a waste of time and effort.
If you want to talk about things that REALLY don't make sense, talk about diesel exhaust being used by the EPA in human tests, some sucking on it for 2 hours at a time.
Your attempt to avoid answering my key questions has been duly noted.

;)
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:41 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:They're in the same camp system so of course they can be compared. I'm saying the alleged steam room Rosenberg was in at Treblinka served a similar purpose to the shower Rosenberg experienced at Flossenberg. . . . Next.
Flossenburg and Treblinka were in the same camp system? Where do you get that?

I had understood that Flossenburg was part of the KL system, whereas Treblinka was part of AR - and that Flossenburg, like Natzweiler, Mauthausen, Gusen, and Gross-Rosen was established near a quarry for forced labor. I'd thought that DEST was involved, and that Flossenburg was founded in the late '30s to source stone.

I must have the wrong Flossenburg.
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Post by iwh » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:52 pm

So if I understand correctly, according to GCH, Treblinka only deloused some people and didn't bother with others.

This makes no sense because as soon as the "transitees" got back together the lice would have spread again. There is no point in just delousing a few. It's a case of all or nothing.

Still......

Where did the deloused clothes come from? How were they deloused? If clothing and valuables were taken away, then where were all the new replacement clothes stored?

Question, questions.....
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Post by iwh » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:01 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:They're in the same camp system so of course they can be compared. I'm saying the alleged steam room Rosenberg was in at Treblinka served a similar purpose to the shower Rosenberg experienced at Flossenberg. . . . Next.
Flossenburg and Treblinka were in the same camp system? Where do you get that?

I had understood that Flossenburg was part of the KL system, whereas Treblinka was part of AR - and that Flossenburg, like Natzweiler, Mauthausen, Gusen, and Gross-Rosen was established near a quarry for forced labor. I'd thought that DEST was involved, and that Flossenburg was founded in the late '30s to source stone.

I must have the wrong Flossenburg.
Apparently they were all transit camps...

:roll:
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:05 pm

iwh wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:
Whoever asks for evidence of trains being cleaned or clothes being distributed didn't watch the video, no further point commenting on that.
Why not?

BTW...I don't get my history from home made videos.
Yea you got it from Spielberg's well polished Oscar winning documentaries such as "The Last Days" - right?

The one vetted by Michael Berenbaum, former head of the USHMM as well as David Cesarini? Starring Irene Zisblatt?

You get your history from Arad and Black.
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Post by gaschamberhoax » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:08 pm

iwh wrote:So why take a shower only to put the old clothes back on? What a waste of time and effort.)
They didn't, but if you watched the video or listened to testimonies such a Rosenberg's you'd know that.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Nessie » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:30 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:........

A path (9) skirts the building and runs along its western wall finally ending at the next building (12) near death-house No. 1 (14). This building is at right-angles to the death-house No. 2. It is a brick construction much smaller than the other. It consists of only three chambers and a steam-room. Along the northern wall of this house runs a corridor from which there are doors to the chambers. The outside walls of the chambers have valves (until recently doors which had been changed into valves for utility reasons). Also here a scoop in the shape of a shallow vessel is placed at the height of the valves (15). The steam-room (15a) is adjacent to the building. Inside the steam-room there is a large vat which produces the steam. The hot steam comes in to the chambers through pipes installed there, each having a prescribed number of vents. While this machinery of death is in action, the doors and valves are hermetically closed. The floor in the chambers has a terra-cotta inlay which becomes very slippery when water is poured over it. There is a well next to the steam-room, the only well in the whole area of Treblinka B.

http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/t/3.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Skeptical about wells and showers but not diesel gas chambers and 1 million non-existent remains. W-w-w-WHAT?
I am not sceptical about there being a well at TII. There was a water supply. I am sceptical about how that well was able to supply water for showers and a steam room(s).

I am also sceptical about diesel gas chambers. I have already said that witnesses make mistakes and that the important part is that they all say people arrived, were put into chambers and died. The means was not steam or vacuums or diesel, it was petrol engines producing CO.

I am sceptical about the number of remains at TII. I doubt there will ever be a satisfactory answer. I am not sceptical that there are enough remains to say TII was a death camp.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Nessie » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:35 pm

gaschamberhoax wrote:
iwh wrote:So why take a shower only to put the old clothes back on? What a waste of time and effort.)
They didn't, but if you watched the video or listened to testimonies such a Rosenberg's you'd know that.
Watching the video does not mean taking it all in at one go and it answering all questions. Presenting a video or lecture and then taking questions is perfectly reasonable.

Please just answer the questions.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Mary Q Contrary » Thu Mar 13, 2014 12:15 am

iwh wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:
Whoever asks for evidence of trains being cleaned or clothes being distributed didn't watch the video, no further point commenting on that.
Why not?

BTW...I don't get my history from home made videos.
If you're not willing to watch the video, you can't really participate in the discussion.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 13, 2014 1:08 am

gaschamberhoax wrote:You get your history from Arad and Black.
The same Arad who knew and wrote in1987 about "your" 1943 transfers from Treblinka? According to his book and even your Word doc?
Last edited by Statistical Mechanic on Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:05 am

Nessie wrote: I am also sceptical about diesel gas chambers. I have already said that witnesses make mistakes and that the important part is that they all say people arrived, were put into chambers and died. The means was not steam or vacuums or diesel, it was petrol engines producing CO.
I wouldn't know either way but I've read more than once that not only were the chambers very small (especially the newer ones) but also that the breathable air was extracted and fumes pumped in. Am not sure if that is verified?

And it seems there is a difference in testing diesel fumes on a healthy person under controlled conditions vs most of the surviving passengers of the transports. They were exhausted to the point of near death after having stood, often for days, in crammed and dirty cars without sufficient ventilation, adequate water or food.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:35 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:You get your history from Arad and Black.
The same Arad who knew and wrote in1987 about "your" 1943 transfers from Treblinka? According to his book and even your Word doc?
Yea the guy who claims 220 men were transited (i'd have to look at it again, but pretty sure it's claimed they were taken from T1, not immediately transferred) when in reality well beyond 10,000 men, women and children were transferred through this "Pure extermination camp" within hours or days.

The guy who claims in an email that they all went directly to the gas chambers (with the exception of those sent to the t1 labor camp.)

That guy.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by gaschamberhoax » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:38 am

scrmbldggs wrote:
Nessie wrote: I am also sceptical about diesel gas chambers. I have already said that witnesses make mistakes and that the important part is that they all say people arrived, were put into chambers and died. The means was not steam or vacuums or diesel, it was petrol engines producing CO.
I wouldn't know either way but I've read more than once that not only were the chambers very small (especially the newer ones) but also that the breathable air was extracted and fumes pumped in. Am not sure if that is verified?

And it seems there is a difference in testing diesel fumes on a healthy person under controlled conditions vs most of the surviving passengers of the transports. They were exhausted to the point of near death after having stood, often for days, in crammed and dirty cars without sufficient ventilation, adequate water or food.
The EPA study used the old and sick. Carbon monoxide doesn't discriminate, whether you're Lance Armstrong or Helen Schwartz. Are you're claiming Helen Schwartz' claim that they die faster when they get the gas if they don't eat is true.

No mater how you slice it diesel exhuast is an absurd choice, but not as absurd as the original choice, deadly steam chambers.

In reality they were really steam rooms / showers.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:46 am

iwh wrote:So why take a shower only to put the old clothes back on? What a waste of time and effort.)
gaschamberhoax wrote:They didn't,
There was neither water pressure to feed showers ( no water tower, no plumbing) nor 490,000 litres of water from the small well at Treblinka to shower people anyway. So you're right. No showers at Treblinka. The building are gas chambers.
gaschamberhoax wrote:but if you watched the video or listened to testimonies such a Rosenberg's you'd know that.
I admit that Heinz Rosenberg did not die in 1943 as stated on this website.
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cg ... d=86721379" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So, I listened to his full audio recording to compare to the edits in your propaganda film. Heinz Rosenberg was a slave worker carpenter. The steam room was in Minsk Ghetto in the soldiers barracks and not in Treblinka. You are lying and you edited his testimony to make it sound like Treblinka
http://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/irn509193" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(Part 1)
("Minsk Ghetto")
at 44.00 "And then after about four weeks, about seven or eight transports arrived, from Germany, the last one came from Vienna, then it stopped. then we started to work. We were picked up in the morning by heavy guards. I worked in the german soldiers room. I had a very good job. I had plenty to eat. I was warm. I worked in the steam room you see, but I had plenty to eat more than the people in the ghetto. I was allowed every Sunday to visit my family. An SS guard took me, you see,

"Going to Treblinka"
at 68.00 "We were marched out of the ghetto, to a small camp, which used to ba a prison camp for the Russian prisoners. A small camp in the city (Minsk). I didn't know it existed. and there were four barracks, actually barracks for horses and there were already some people there, some jews, "We are from Smolensk". we got in and there was another SS commander and guards. "You will be here until your transport leaves". "Where are we going?" "I do not know. I cannot tell you. You will get food and if you behave properly nothing will happen to you". and one person, he made a question. 'What about our wives?" and he was shot "bang". You see.

at 70.00 "The people from Smolensk told us that the Smolensk ghetto had been closed. These were the last people they took out. I said "Come on this cannot be?" "Yes" they said. over two years. I realised this had happened to our people (Minsk) but after three days Mr (Rueber?) the SS commander, came and said I have very good news for you. You can each write a note to your loved ones and if you have wives they will be permitted to join you here. So I wrote and wrote to my wife on a small piece of paper I had, I dont want Erica to come because to me it looks very bad. i wrote in French or english as I didn't want ....we didn't think they (guards) would read it. Two days later I got a letter from my parents from home (Minsk Ghetto) Six days later about fifty women arrived all for the married men. also with a little knapsack. It cannot be so bad if they present the women here. ....at that went on until September 14th 1943. And very early on September 14th, the SS commander of this camp told us "get ready for transport". It was five in the morning. We packed our little bag as we were not allowed to take anything with us. he said "The men to the left, the women to the right" "first I bring the men to the railroad and then the women so you can prepare"
And again under very heavy guards we are taken to the railroads. It is the last time I saw Erica (his wife) The women never came. When we went to the train station, we passed the ghetto (Minsk). They must have heard or seen something, they are standing there saying hello. I can't remember. the ghetto was still alive on September 14 1943 with 2,500 people. if the russian Jews were still there I don't know. And we were taken to a cattle cart now, no heat, no stove nothing, no food, no water.

at 74.30 "I think we were on the transport for two or three days. I honestly can't remember it now. The doors were never opened. they gave us one little pail but you know 100 people in a car, it went over right away. And then we stopped. we could not look out. All night long they would move that car back and forth ..... then early in the morning the SS opened these cattle car doors and we were standing there with the German shepherds and they shouted "get out you dirty Jews, get out run run run" and we saw a gate and it said Treblinka and it said "Arbeit macht frie" the work will make you free. This was the 17th or 18 September 1943.

(at 75.50) And we came to this camp, we had to run. there was a terrible sweet smell. We did not know what Treblinka was. we had no idea. And we saw prisoners pulling enormous loads laden with shoes and clothes. And we were put separate on one spot . Of the 200, some had died. I can't remember how may made it. 240 probably. There were couples and there were Dutch Jews and they told us "Where you from?" "From Minsk" They said this is a "Command to heaven camp" "What are you talking about?"
"You will find out, do you have anything valuable? You won't need it anymore" They were 100% sure we would be gassed too. So after a while we were standing there for about three hours, we were not permitted to go to the toilet. After three hours a SS delegation came and said "Are there any carpenters here?" Yes there were three carpenters. "Any locksmiths here?" "Any plumbers here?" "Any electricians?" Yes. "Get out, get out, get out". "I knew about this because I was in the steam room" Everybody went as gardeners. We never saw the gardeners again. But we were put on the side to a barracks and we had to undress. We did not have prison uniforms but old clothes with a mark. so we undressed

978.36) We then went into a room. we did not know what it was. We were given new clothes and wooden shoes. they then came in and said "you are going to be transferred to (Plaszow?) The Kapo said to us "You are the first group that came here and goes out of here alive" So we still did not know what Treblinka was. I had never heard of Treblinka before but we heard this man and he said "this is a death sector" We did not know what a death sector was.

So that evening they put us back on a cattle car" We arrived the next morning.


Your exact lies
1) In your propaganda video you say at 12.01 "A similar process took place at Treblinka, Auschwitz and other camps" (The steam room mentioned by Rosenberg was in the soldiers barracks in the Minsk Ghetto and not at any camps).

2) You then play an edited audio of Rosenbergs story. "I was in the steam room" but you edited out that that steam room was in Minsk exactly as Rosenberg said.

Please explain why you edited out real evidence for your lying propaganda video?

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:06 am

A carpenter? Wood is steamed to bend it. Is he talking about that kind of room?
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:13 am

scrmbldggs wrote:A carpenter? Wood is steamed to bend it. Is he talking about that kind of room?
He's talking about his work detail in the German soldiers barracks at the Minsk ghetto. He doesn't say what the "Steam room" at the German barracks was. It might be a sauna or the boiler room for European central heating. He doesn't say.

Minsk Hotels with a Steam Room
http://www.hotel.com.au/Minsk/Steam-Room.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've ordered the complete Shoah scripts and original testimonies, which are compiled. I' will then compare & contrast more of Eric Hunt's edited propaganda video to reality.

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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:21 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:A carpenter? Wood is steamed to bend it. Is he talking about that kind of room?
He's talking about his work detail in the German soldiers barracks at the Minsk ghetto. He doesn't say what the "Steam room" at the German barracks was. It might be a sauna or the boiler room for European central heating. He doesn't say.

Minsk Hotels with a Steam Room
http://www.hotel.com.au/Minsk/Steam-Room.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've ordered the complete Shoah scripts and original testimonies, which are compiled. I' will then compare & contrast more of Eric Hunt's edited propaganda video to reality.
Or the laundry...

Thanks, Matthew. :-D
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:04 am

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.p ... 14#p394887" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
gaschamberhoax wrote:
Nessie wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:
(quote completed by) scrmbldggs wrote:It also would seem well-advised to rely on the words of those who lived during that time and were well informed.
7. Another improvement we made over Treblinka was that we built our gas chambers to accommodate 2,000 people at one time, whereas at Treblinka their 10 gas chambers only accommodated 200 people each.
...
I understand English as it is written above. The above statements are true; this declaration is made by me voluntarily and without compulsion; after reading over the statement, I have signed and executed the same at Nurnberg, Germany on the fifth day of April 1946.
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1946Hoess.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
You're right, that's why I rely on the November 1942 report on the steam room complex that is know proven to be accurate due to the recent discovery of the terra cotta floors which corroborate claims about the steam room complex's appearance, structure, and purpose.

Only the claim that this was a deadly steam room is inaccurate, not backed up by any evidence, and is in fact proven to be a non-lethal steam room by witnesses such as Rosenberg.

You can also "rely" on the testimony of the Jews which, corroborated by the evidence also prove this was a transit camp.

Next.
Where did the water come from for the supposed steam room to function?

Why are tiles only an indication of a steam room and not a gas chamber?

A path (9) skirts the building and runs along its western wall finally ending at the next building (12) near death-house No. 1 (14). This building is at right-angles to the death-house No. 2. It is a brick construction much smaller than the other. It consists of only three chambers and a steam-room. Along the northern wall of this house runs a corridor from which there are doors to the chambers. The outside walls of the chambers have valves (until recently doors which had been changed into valves for utility reasons). Also here a scoop in the shape of a shallow vessel is placed at the height of the valves (15). The steam-room (15a) is adjacent to the building. Inside the steam-room there is a large vat which produces the steam. The hot steam comes in to the chambers through pipes installed there, each having a prescribed number of vents. While this machinery of death is in action, the doors and valves are hermetically closed. The floor in the chambers has a terra-cotta inlay which becomes very slippery when water is poured over it. There is a well next to the steam-room, the only well in the whole area of Treblinka B.

http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/t/3.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Skeptical about wells and showers but not diesel gas chambers and 1 million non-existent remains. W-w-w-WHAT?
(emphasis by me)


That seems to be the hair steaming facility.
scrmbldggs wrote:...

As to steam:
Treblinka survivor Oscar Strawczynski received information about the Totenlager from Hershel Jablkowski, he was a Smith in Treblinka, whilst Oscar Strawczynski was a tinsmith, he called:

....

As mentioned before, the people leave all their belongings in Camp 1. Everyone is undressed there. The women already naked, are seated on a long bench and their hair is cut off. This is accomplished by about forty “hairdressers.”

"The hair is then cleaned with steam, using a steam kettle brought especially for this purpose. The hair is then packed in bales, and sent out along with the clothing and other wares.
http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... mbers.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.p ... 11#p394700" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by scrmbldggs » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:34 am

gaschamberhoax wrote:
scrmbldggs wrote:
Nessie wrote: I am also sceptical about diesel gas chambers. I have already said that witnesses make mistakes and that the important part is that they all say people arrived, were put into chambers and died. The means was not steam or vacuums or diesel, it was petrol engines producing CO.
I wouldn't know either way but I've read more than once that not only were the chambers very small (especially the newer ones) but also that the breathable air was extracted and fumes pumped in. Am not sure if that is verified?

And it seems there is a difference in testing diesel fumes on a healthy person under controlled conditions vs most of the surviving passengers of the transports. They were exhausted to the point of near death after having stood, often for days, in crammed and dirty cars without sufficient ventilation, adequate water or food.
The EPA study used the old and sick. Carbon monoxide doesn't discriminate, whether you're Lance Armstrong or Helen Schwartz. Are you're claiming Helen Schwartz' claim that they die faster when they get the gas if they don't eat is true.

No mater how you slice it diesel exhuast is an absurd choice, but not as absurd as the original choice, deadly steam chambers.

In reality they were really steam rooms / showers.

Couldn't find any study done on humans. Only this (were the rats/other animals old and sick?):
Diesel engine exhaust (CASRN N.A.)

The evidence for chronic respiratory effects is based mainly on animal studies showing consistent findings of inflammatory, histopathological (including fibrosis), and functional changes in the pulmonary and tracheobronchial regions of laboratory animals, including the rat, mouse, hamster, guinea pig, monkey, and cat. Of 17 studies covering these species, the rat is the most studied test animal, though positive responses are also seen in mice, guinea pigs, monkeys, and hamsters. Most are single dose studies, except for five multi-dose studies discussed below.

The multi-dose studies, by Ishinishi et al. (1986, 1988), Mauderly et al. (1987a), Heinrich et al. (1995), and Nikula et al. (1995), show exposure-response relationships based on chronic inhalation exposure to whole diesel exhaust in rats. The effects observed include inflammation, histopathology (including fibrosis), and functional changes in the pulmonary and tracheobronchial regions. An array of these key studies and their effect levels (NOAEL, LOAEL, BMCL10, AEL) prior to conversion to human equivalent concentrations (HECs) is shown in Table I.B.1. This array provides an inter-study concentration-response continuum, normalized to human equivalent continuous diesel particulate matter (DPM) exposure levels, facilitating the choice of a concentration to use as a point of departure in deriving an RfC.
http://www.epa.gov/iris/subst/0642.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Could you please point us to the EPA inhalation study on humans? Thank you.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by iwh » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:57 am

gaschamberhoax wrote:
Yea you got it from Spielberg's well polished Oscar winning documentaries such as "The Last Days" - right?
Nope. Never seen it.
You get your history from Arad and Black.
Arad actually.
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Re: TOP SECRET-For Revisionist Eyes Only

Post by iwh » Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:00 am

Mary Q Contrary wrote:
iwh wrote:
gaschamberhoax wrote:
Whoever asks for evidence of trains being cleaned or clothes being distributed didn't watch the video, no further point commenting on that.
Why not?

BTW...I don't get my history from home made videos.
If you're not willing to watch the video, you can't really participate in the discussion.
I can participate in whatever discussion I like. Please tell me how my questions and comments are anyway invalidated by not watching said video.

Thank you.
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