A Radio Challenge

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Chester
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Re: Diesel Engines Not Used in Holocaust

Post by Chester » Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:13 pm

Lemmy Caution wrote:
Roberto Muehlenkamp wrote: Too lazy to follow my links, Chester?

Or too dumb to understand what is written there?
Too busy giving you condescending and useless advice and coming up with presumptuous grades for what people post in the forum, I would guess.
Yes, I know that you are "Too busy giving you condescending and useless advice"

How many forums are you posting on?

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:31 pm

You think that is funny - and your dodging is cute? Pathetic. You appear to be unable to click on links - or to deal with what you find there.
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Re: Diesel Engines Not Used in Holocaust

Post by Roberto Muehlenkamp » Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:00 pm

Chester wrote:
Roberto Muehlenkamp wrote: Too lazy to follow my links, Chester?

Or too dumbto understand what is written there?

If you confess to either or both, I'll be glad to give you a summary of what you can read under the links I provided.

Short and sweet please. I want *your* words.

Just write the following:"I'm too lazy to follow your links and/or too dumb to understand what is written there. Please give me a concise version adapted to my laziness and/or lack of intelligence." Then you'll get your "concise version". I shall point you to posts

No thanks. I want it from the horses mouth so to speak

Otherwise, shut up, follow the links and read.
I didn't think you would be able to tell us. You can only refer to long and ponderous and convoluted informational obfuscations.

Please, just tell us in terms everybody can understand, why CO does not cause red coloration.
The point is not that CO does not cause red coloration in general.

One point is that it does not cause red coloration in people suffering from malnutrition-related conditions, namely anemia and/or reduced heart and respiratory function, i.e. among the overwhelming majority of people gassed with engine exhaust, who had been deported from malnourished or starving ghettos in Poland.

Another point is that it does not cause red coloration in people who suffocated from lack of oxygen before CO poisoning took effect, as is likely to have happened to many of the gassing victims and is suggested by eyewitness descriptions pointing to suffocation.

Yet another point is that when it causes red coloration, it usually does so at the stage of livor mortis and not at the moment of death. Livor mortis appears as patches in the head and neck region 30 minutes after death, becomes confluent after 1 – 4 hours (which is when it may be visible to a casual observer looking at the corpse's dependent parts where the blood accumulates, as opposed to a physician doing a close examination of the corpse) and reaches its maximum after 3 – 16 hours. Livor mortis is usually bluish-violet due to the deoxygenated blood, bright red in cases of carbon monoxide or hydrocyanide poisoning. There are some eyewitness descriptions of ARC gassing victims right after death (when the gas chamber doors were opened), but there are none, as far as I know, of ARC gassing victims at the stage of confluent livor mortis

There are some other aspects to be considered, but these three alone mean that there's no reason why eyewitnesses should have necessarily noticed a bright-red color on the corpses of gassing victims.

I hope that was simple enough for your meager intellect to grasp. If not, I'll try to dumb it down a little further.

Meanwhile, you can try substantiating your silly accusation of "long and ponderous and convoluted informational obfuscations". Especially the "obfuscations" part.

Or humbly apologize for that crap.

Who is "us" here, by the way?

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Gas Engines Not Used in Holocaust

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:11 am

Roberto Muehlenkamp wrote:
The point is not that CO does not cause red coloration in general.

One point is that it does not cause red coloration in people suffering from malnutrition-related conditions, namely anemia and/or reduced heart and respiratory function, i.e. among the overwhelming majority of people gassed with engine exhaust, who had been deported from malnourished or starving ghettos in Poland.

Yeah, they die before they reach the 60%. But that is moot. You admitted that diesel is out and gas is in. My position is that nobody got red because gas engine CO was not used to kill anybody. The only thing that was gassed was lice nits. There were no homicidal gas chambers.

Another point is that it does not cause red coloration in people who suffocated from lack of oxygen before CO poisoning took effect, as is likely to have happened to many of the gassing victims and is suggested by eyewitness descriptions pointing to suffocation.

The meat industry uses CO to make dead meat red.

Yet another point is that when it causes red coloration, it usually does so at the stage of livor mortis and not at the moment of death. Livor mortis appears as patches in the head and neck region 30 minutes after death, becomes confluent after 1 – 4 hours (which is when it may be visible to a casual observer looking at the corpse's dependent parts where the blood accumulates, as opposed to a physician doing a close examination of the corpse) and reaches its maximum after 3 – 16 hours. Livor mortis is usually bluish-violet due to the deoxygenated blood, bright red in cases of carbon monoxide or hydrocyanide poisoning. There are some eyewitness descriptions of ARC gassing victims right after death (when the gas chamber doors were opened), but there are none, as far as I know, of ARC gassing victims at the stage of confluent livor mortis

There are some other aspects to be considered, but these three alone mean that there's no reason why eyewitnesses should have necessarily noticed a bright-red color on the corpses of gassing victims.

I have no knowledge of this topic but will ask some comrades.

I hope that was simple enough for your meager intellect to grasp. If not, I'll try to dumb it down a little further.

Please do. Make it real simple for me.

Meanwhile, you can try substantiating your silly accusation of "long and ponderous and convoluted informational obfuscations". Especially the "obfuscations" part.

Or humbly apologize for that crap.

There are four ways to reply to revisionism. One of those tactics is 'informational.'. . . "long and ponderous and convoluted informational obfuscations". If the shoe fits, wear it.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:18 am

Translation: Revisionism appeals to simpletons.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:30 am

With, "Revisionism appeals to Simpletons" that's a full 25% of the twaddle that Chester was going to write now dealt with. :mrgreen:

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 1:05 am

Darren Wilshak wrote:With, "Revisionism appeals to Simpletons" that's a full 25% of the twaddle that Chester was going to write now dealt with. :mrgreen:
If you're gonna be a smartass, first you have to be smart. Otherwise . . .


Everybody tune-in

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:33 am

Chester wrote: I'd bet a buck a beer and a cigarette that Roberto is a no-show.
He's a KbKommando but Mr. Berg is sonder.
Today is 22 June.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Hans » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:17 pm

Shouldn't the debate be on now? There is just a Maggie Roddin and some "poor whites" stuff.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Hans » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:22 pm

Aha, it's still 40 minutes to go.

http://republicbroadcasting.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (Studio A)

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:41 pm

Hans wrote:Aha, it's still 40 minutes to go.

http://republicbroadcasting.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (Studio A)
I suggest you take notes, I am. 20 minutes and counting.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Nessie » Fri Jun 22, 2012 4:44 pm

Roberto turned up! Hey Chester, will you accept you were wrong to claim he would not turn up, that makes you a liar and so your credibility is destroyed.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:06 pm

I would say, "idiot" for making his prediction and losing. He's been considered an incompetent liar since the Sereny debacle.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:38 pm

Nessie wrote:Roberto turned up! Hey Chester, will you accept you were wrong to claim he would not turn up, that makes you a liar and so your credibility is destroyed.

My job was to goad Roberto into showing up. Do you understand this concept? The fact is he showed up and his words are in the public record. This is great!

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:45 pm

Chester wrote:
Nessie wrote:Roberto turned up! Hey Chester, will you accept you were wrong to claim he would not turn up, that makes you a liar and so your credibility is destroyed.

My job was to goad Roberto into showing up. Do you understand this concept? The fact is he showed up and his words are in the public record. This is great!
Since Roberto has no history of backing down, since Roberto has sought out forums in which to debate - on and off air, and since Chester is a nobody, Roberto needed not a whit of goading in order to appear on the show. He planned to debate from the outset. OTOH, Chester's odd bit of self-delusion concerning Roberto and his inflated view of his own impact on Roberto is now in the public record. This is great!
Last edited by Lemmy Caution on Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:46 pm

Darren Wilshak wrote:I would say, "idiot" for making his prediction and losing. He's been considered an incompetent liar since the Sereny debacle.
Thanks for the kind words. Debacle, you say? She said Auschwitz was not an extermination camp. She was known for her candor and research skills. Get used to it. :)

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:48 pm

Simpleton's logic.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:48 pm

Chester wrote:
Darren Wilshak wrote:I would say, "idiot" for making his prediction and losing. He's been considered an incompetent liar since the Sereny debacle.
Thanks for the kind words. Debacle, you say? She said Auschwitz was not an extermination camp. She was known for her candor and research skills. Get used to it. :)
Ah, from Chester's lie about the date and his coverup . . . he keeps repeating his ignorant misunderstanding of Sereny's words, who are no bother to a single normal person on this forum, much as Chester tries deluding himself to the contrary.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Hans » Fri Jun 22, 2012 6:02 pm

Well done, Roberto.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Nessie » Fri Jun 22, 2012 6:06 pm

Chester wrote:
Nessie wrote:Roberto turned up! Hey Chester, will you accept you were wrong to claim he would not turn up, that makes you a liar and so your credibility is destroyed.

My job was to goad Roberto into showing up. Do you understand this concept? The fact is he showed up and his words are in the public record. This is great!
Well it came over as a bully's attempt to get him not to turn up. In any case, its not your job to do such a thing.

Otherwise it went as I thought, round and round and with both sides being able to claim victory as to scoring points over each other and no new facts presented. But for me Roberto presented better and Berg was a gloating ass of a man.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:45 pm

Nessie wrote: Well it came over as a bully's attempt to get him not to turn up. In any case, its not your job to do such a thing.

Sometimes things are not what they seem.

Otherwise it went as I thought, round and round and with both sides being able to claim victory as to scoring points over each other and no new facts presented. But for me Roberto presented better and Berg was a gloating ass of a man.
I think the moderation sucked. Neither one hit any home runs. However, Frederich Berg won on points. Monthly debates would be great. Also a monthly call in show where one revo man gets interviewed by exterminationists. The next month versa visa.

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:00 pm

Yeah, everyone will take Chesterton Flyover's word for who fared best. LOL.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:53 pm

Lemmy Caution wrote:Yeah, everyone will take Chesterton Flyover's word for who fared best. LOL.
You could express an opinion on the debate but you would rather ridicule my name. Chesterton is a family name. At least I use my name while you use the name of an old time drunk detective. I'll bet you are an old fart. I know you're a weedy swag-bellied whey-face.

Nessie weighed in, I did too. What say you?

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:05 pm

Chester wrote:
Lemmy Caution wrote:Yeah, everyone will take Chesterton Flyover's word for who fared best. LOL.
You could express an opinion on the debate but you would rather ridicule my name. Chesterton is a family name. At least I use my name while you use the name of an old time drunk detective. I'll bet you are an old fart. I know you're a weedy swag-bellied whey-face.

Nessie weighed in, I did too. What say you?
My opinion is that I didn't hear it. I was in a meeting at work. Hoping there's a podcast.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Nessie » Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:51 pm

I thought the moderation was good, she was clear about time keeping, stuck to the time keeping and did not weigh in with her own comments.

The adverts made it hard going though, there were millions of them!
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:04 am

Well, I will give Berg this much: he is incoherent. What does his old canard "producer gas" have to do with Roberto's broad argument about the program and its various methods? Essentially, Berg is arguing that the Nazis are alleged to have killed with costly or inappropriate means, therefore no killing (at the AR camps, that is). "Rubbish"!

Not so much high on the moderation - she cut Roberto off, then put herself on mute or was sleeping during Berg's bad tangent.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:14 am

Again, on the topic of moderation, Spingola would have done better to have framed some questions, I think, than to read some blather from Dalton and then let the thing unwind. By not framing some topics for discussion, we get Roberto trying to set up a full argument for the Holocaust - countered by the usual denier anomaly hunting 1) producer gas, which Berg's been at for decades and 2) cherry red coloring, which Berg's been at for years and years. Too bad, also, that Berg has such poor material, that hurts the show as well (I am listening as I type).

To get into matters like livor mortis, etc., in a discussion for a general audience is probably confusing to the half dozen people in Spingola's audience. Berg's riff on corpse color is kind of a flight of fancy - in that he doesn't cite more than one or two witnesses even noticing and reporting corpse color - then tries to build on this flimsy foundation.

Berg and his healthy Jews . . . "typhus brought on largely by the attacks of the Allies . . . One can see fat Jews" at Bergen-Belsen . . . "She was a black marketeer! . . . The Jews were making lots of money trading in everything . . . The Warsaw ghetto was a wonderful market . . ." Nessie, please, this is such ahistorical crap and random blather. Berg couldn't even use up his 8 minutes . . . he just started breathing hard after working himself up about the black market - and Spingola had to try to rescue him. Trouble is that he tried to reprise his JREF Stundie on breath holding. What a moron.

Roberto as usual is methodical and measured, making an excellent impression, trying to focus and being factual given the rather difficult format. When asked a question, Roberto is responsive, informative, and level headed. He leaves aside the hyperbole and name calling we all so enjoy in Internet forums. As an aside, it makes me happy that Roberto pronounces Belzec correctly.

"You out to be ashamed of yourself, Mr Muehlemkamp!" "Rubbish, Mr Muehlenkamp!" LOL, I guess this - along with Berg's shilling for his Website - is what Chester Flyover means by dumbing it down and trying to market it.

Berg: "I'm not Jewish at all." At all! LOL
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:38 am

But the main questions are: Did Mr Muehlenkamp show up? And did he need Chester in the peanut gallery to goad him into doing so?
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:44 am

Berg sure does work himself up with non sequiturs and poorly grounded one liners from what he imagines to be his greatest hits CD.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:45 am

Wonderful here comes Berg's "the Jews were kept alive by the Nazis" and the real killers were the Western Allies and bombing, with a hard b. I am hoping for Berg to do his disgusting Steve Jobs presentation, although photos are hard to work with on radio.

Nessie, seriously, you think this is a draw? "He really has nothing . . . except for these totally ridiculous eyewitness accounts. . . . They cherrypick the evidence. . . . Rubbish, Mr Muehlenkamp . . . You can't even get very many uh er historians to agree that the source of carbon monoxide was gasoline engines. Most of them, I am sure, still believe that diesel gas was still used. . ." The man is a rambling, incoherent idiot, who isn't even sure what historians argue, even as he supposedly critiques it.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 11:13 am

Berg is sure Roberto is nice to his mother and his family but "we're on the verge of world war III because of Holocaust lunacy." LOL

The uniforms-on-corpses-in-mass-graves gambit is one I've missed . . . strange. All those soldiers hanging out at Treblinka and Sobibor . . .
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Sat Jun 23, 2012 12:42 pm

And it seems now that the only thing backing up Berg's argument (Rubbish Mr. Muehlenkamp, rubbish!) that there were gasoline shortages in Germany is one propaganda piece that was published in a US. newspaper. With no sources. Which clipping is also of course too in the cuttings scrapbook of the loony Black Rabbit of Inle's. Upon the CODOH. forum.

:lol:

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:03 pm

Darren Wilshak wrote:And it seems now that the only thing backing up Berg's argument (Rubbish Mr. Muehlenkamp, rubbish!) that there were gasoline shortages in Germany is one propaganda piece that was published in a US. newspaper. With no sources. Which clipping is also of course too in the cuttings scrapbook of the loony Black Rabbit of Inle's. Upon the CODOH. forum.

:lol:
Well, he had sources on his frozen laptop. LOL
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:58 pm

The period of self-doubt has begun, I am told, amongst the intellectual giants that inhabit 'net warrens for deniers. Here's something a denier calling itself Blake posted at CODOH, beginning the post-Spingola stock-taking, just as lamentations and wailing could be heard post-Kevin Barrett from those quarters - all the woulda, coulda, shoulda won't rescue Berg, who flailed and failed, despite Nessie's rather tepid and not too aware summation over at JREF:
I thought the debate was very confused and would surely confuse someone not particularly knowledgeable with the issues. Roberto actually had a few "wins" in my opinion:

1. Fritz peppered ad hominems throughout his arguments ("people such as Roberto should think how I think" - and things like that).
2. Making an argument such as "Germans would have used producer gas and not engine exhaust or Zyklon-B" isn't particularly convincing w/o some fleshing out of the position - which wasn't satisfactorily done by Fritz. Although Fritz did make a good point about the slow-release properties of Zyklon-B; which I'd think that even someone very green to the issue might investigate this claim and its implications.
3. Roberto gave more of a holistic type argument (albeit from either a delusional or mendacious perspective since his arguments are false on a thin investigation).

Here are suggestions for Fritz of what I think would make a more compelling position from him. I'm thinking of reaching people who only have a thin knowledge of the Holocaust.

1. Start off by defining the Holocaust: what it is and what it isn't and what you deny and don't deny.
2. Go over the audio of the debate and try to come up with the most succinct and straight-forward way to refute every one of Roberto's falsities. For instance, Roberto made claims that the AR camps could plausibly have stored 100s of thousands of bodies. Succinctly state the AR camp narrative (it's prima facie absurd as alleged w/o even having to analyse much).
3. Flesh out the red corpse issue you're so fond of. It's a good argument but I think it probably goes over the head of a green listener.
4. Don't be so adamant about your pet "producer gas" argument. You weren't as bad with this as you usually are. The main issue here is that the claimed gassing operations are foolishly inappropriate, not that you can think up a better way (although a quick mention of your producer gas wouldn't be bad). Zyklon-B is inappropriate because it needs to be heated and continues outgassing for many hours. Maybe even try to come up with a succinct summary of the prussian blue issues w.r.t. this. Engine exhaust is inappropriate because you don't need a whole complicated engine to produce CO which is trivially easy to do w/o an engine. No eyewitness mentioned red corpses (and in fact blue corpses were claimed) when the corpses would have been red had people died from CO. Roberto would trot out his mendacious make-it-up-as-you-go-along crap which you could use to make him look very bad on cross-examination.

I also would have liked more of a dialogue format to the debate rather than set speechifying. Rebuttals of points as they are made (in a civil way of course) would have been nice. W/o handling things this way I'm afraid that the debate was a confused jumbled mess.
Not bad, for a denier, although I would tally more than a few wins for Roberto, who once again showed his class, knowledge, and insight. The revs themselves feel the pain, Nessie. Will the mutual recriminations that followed the Dalton debacle ensue, or do the revs just want to shut the door on this one, declare victory, that is, and hope for another day . . . ?
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Pyrrho » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:06 pm

I'm thinking of reaching people who only have a thin knowledge of the Holocaust.
Therein lies the reason why deniers cherry-pick information and focus on outliers.
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:17 pm

Pyrrho wrote:
I'm thinking of reaching people who only have a thin knowledge of the Holocaust.
Therein lies the reason why deniers cherry-pick information and focus on outliers.
And, it seems to me, why Chester advocates a marketing approach to the topic, with catch phrases and sound bites (like Berg's repetition of "Rubbish"), rather than an informed and factual discussion.

I would add to Blake's critique, which has surprising moments of lucidity, that deniers make a profoundly stupid and even bizarre assumption in these appearances: they underestimate grotesquely their status in the eyes of typical people. Deniers start with a massive deficit - not on the ascendancy and gaining respect as Chester promises he will demonstrate; they are sort of intellectual lepers, to use a Biblical allusion. But they invariably approach an audience predisposed to think of them this way as triumphant - brimming with condescension for their opponents, smug in their reviled stance, and sneering in their explanations. Of course, this is their right - but it is also a tactical blunder of the highest order, speaking poorly for their ability to size up situations, understand the dynamics of the real world, and appreciate their position. Why? Because, along with speaking "insider" gibberish, their arrogance will put off nearly all listeners. All that I can conclude from this is that they really are as deluded as they come across.
Saramago: "All this would be absurd if it weren't happening."

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Darren Wilshak
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Darren Wilshak » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:32 pm

Blake is a moderate denier, clearly awash with truthiness and wanting to believe but he also possesses some honesty. That is a rare thing in the average revisionist.

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Lemmy Caution
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Lemmy Caution » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:50 pm

Chester wrote: I'd bet a buck a beer and a cigarette that Roberto is a no-show.
Although there was no formal bet placed, Chester has been exposed as someone with terribly poor judgment and a loose connection to reality.

I think the beer and cigarette should be sent to Roberto. Along with the apologies which Chester owes him.
Saramago: "All this would be absurd if it weren't happening."

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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Chester » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:27 pm

Lemmy Caution wrote:
Pyrrho wrote:
I'm thinking of reaching people who only have a thin knowledge of the Holocaust.
Therein lies the reason why deniers cherry-pick information and focus on outliers.
Just weeding the garden or picking the poisonous fruit so to speak. That plus usual and customary marketing strategies equal a modified holocaust which will be a breath of fresh air to the world. A revised holocaust history for those who have become holocaust fatigued.

. . . rather than an informed and factual discussion.

You can have "informed and factual discussion" at CODOH. What you can't have at CODOH is mud slinging (your stock-in-trade). Without the histrionics, all you have is a divergence of evidence. Pressac summarized it like this:

i. Holocaust history is bankrupt.
ii. History based on witness accounts and used to fit the need at hand.
iii. Truncated to fit an arbitrary truth.
iv. Sprinkled with a few non-related German documents of uneven value.


Your shield of law is disappearing. Section 13 of the Canadian Human Rights Act (CHRA) has been flushed. Where people were fined or jailed for hurting someones feelings and where the truth is no defense.

You no longer have the moral high road. Its now the lieroad you own. Holocaust damage control is now at DefCon 2 and the threat level is indicating a repeat of history. Heretofore, I didn't realize the absolute fear that revisionism is creating. The fear is international in scope. Will let you all know the growth rate when I quantify it.:http://cjnews.com/international/toulous ... node/90230


Nice series of posts, Lemmy. Unfortunatly you'll only get paid for one. ;)

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Nessie
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Re: A Radio Challenge

Post by Nessie » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:43 pm

Chester wrote:
.....

You can have "informed and factual discussion" at CODOH. What you can't have at CODOH is mud slinging (your stock-in-trade). ......

.......
That is not true, see my thread on the CODOH

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=18034" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Chester I enjoy your rhetoric, it reminds me of the bombastic Evangelicals you hear in the US. :D
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