Brexit

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Re: Brexit

Post by TJrandom » Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:35 pm

Poodle wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:27 pm
At last the truth is is out ...
A report delivered by the Daily Express ... "Meanwhile a high-ranking German politician has said a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic will be needed in the event of a no-deal Brexit to keep chlorinated chicken out of the EU - ignoring the fact that it is not allowed in the UK either."
So it's all YOUR fault, USA! Hang your heads in shame!
But it's nice to know that Germany, as well as the UK, has its fair share of dickheads in politics.

(Note for USA readers ... Yes, I know that there's little to no health risk in treating chicken carcasses by chlorination. But please don't tell the EU, as a source of humour may dry up).
I had no idea... :roll: There is a survey question in this Metro article, with the anti-chlorine-ers running 2:1 ahead of the chlorine eaters. I presume most of the respondents to be UK/EU, but I voted for more chlorine. But then, it is quite rare that I eat the birds.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:33 pm

Hmmmm - no one else appears to be running the 'kick Ireland into touch' story, so it may be a load of codswallop. Tomorrow morning will show us the truth.

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:48 pm

I worked on a chicken ranch in the USA in the 60's. We used detergent to make the eggs nice and white but didn't chlorinate the carcasses. I never knew we were so environmentally friendly.

Having owned an 18 unit apartment complex.......I WISH I had tenants as wonderful as yours Upton.

Poodle: of course the EU will. You seem to think that Brexit is a totally neutral act and that EU should "help" you have as pleasant an experience as possible. I'll rephrase a prior comment: when the Sourthern States of the USA tried to Exit: we killed 1.5 million of ourselves to stop it. Requiring the UK to shoulder ALL the negatives consequences of their decision is ONLY very civilized.

REF that was not asked: Do you want to leave the EU, have a hard border between the Irelands, have Scotland leave our Union, and have the price of food and medicine go up an immediate 30% or more? Yes or No? aka: the "simple" REF asked was a CON JOB merely calling for emotions. Its why Putin funded it. .........not that Putin is all bad.
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Re: Brexit

Post by landrew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:50 pm

Chlorine is a fairly benign substance that dissipates from food or drink fairly quickly.
But it sounds like a chemical, so it's easier to vilify.
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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:02 pm

landrew wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:50 pm
Chlorine is a fairly benign substance that dissipates from food or drink fairly quickly.
But it sounds like a chemical, so it's easier to vilify.
Lots of places drink it on purpose as the alternative is everyone is going to die.
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Re: Brexit

Post by landrew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:18 pm

Chlorine has been used as a safe disinfectant for many years. Ultraviolet light works better because it doesn't leave any residue, but it doesn't penetrate inside foods. That's when someone thought to use a different wavelength of radiation that penetrates through the food completely. Technically, this is know as irradiating food, and hooboy, that's when it became another boogeyman. What's in a name? Everything to alarmists.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:27 pm

Poodle wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:06 pm
I trust you kept the coins?
Actually, no. I wanted to conceal the crime, not profit by it. Mainly, I didn't want to have to explain what the hell a parking meter was doing in my basement the next time I had the furnace worked on.
“It is certainly sad and regrettable that so many innocent people died…Stalin was absolutely adamant on making doubly sure: spare no one…I don’t deny that I supported that view. I was simply not able to study every individual case…It was hard to draw a precise line where to stop.”

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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:29 pm

bobbo_the_Pragmatist wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:48 pm
Having owned an 18 unit apartment complex.......I WISH I had tenants as wonderful as yours Upton.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

I can well imagine. It must be a nightmare dealing with 18 deadbeats rent-payers.
“It is certainly sad and regrettable that so many innocent people died…Stalin was absolutely adamant on making doubly sure: spare no one…I don’t deny that I supported that view. I was simply not able to study every individual case…It was hard to draw a precise line where to stop.”

Vyacheslav Mikhailovich Skryabin (“Molotov”)

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:49 pm

Ha, ha.........I never escaped "feeling bad" for most of them. Of course.........I went broke in an up market. Longer story, not worth the telling.....but our court system is too soft on both tenants and landlords who don't comply with the rental contract.

Its enough to turn anyone............................cynical.
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Re: Brexit

Post by landrew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:50 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:27 pm
Poodle wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:06 pm
I trust you kept the coins?
Actually, no. I wanted to conceal the crime, not profit by it. Mainly, I didn't want to have to explain what the hell a parking meter was doing in my basement the next time I had the furnace worked on.
Did it ever occur to you to turn it into the police with a complete and truthful explanation?
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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:55 pm

landrew wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:50 pm
Did it ever occur to you to turn it into the police with a complete and truthful explanation?
Thats what I would have done. When not a "suspect" myself, I enjoy observing how incompetent most police are. Its my proof as to how dumb most criminals are. Of note, on the facts as I understand them....no charges could be brought against anyone as long as the tenants all played dumb. I doubt any investigation would be made at all..........so.........just process all around. My main issue would then be: is returning the equipment to the parking service (another option) been a help to them or not monetarily wise? I assume it would help, so its the right thing to do......
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:16 am

Well, the 'kick Ireland out of the single market' story has NOT been run by anyone else. However, the Express still have it on their website. Make of that what you will. I suspect sloppy editing.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:25 am

landrew wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:50 pm
Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:27 pm
Poodle wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:06 pm
I trust you kept the coins?
Actually, no. I wanted to conceal the crime, not profit by it. Mainly, I didn't want to have to explain what the hell a parking meter was doing in my basement the next time I had the furnace worked on.
Did it ever occur to you to turn it into the police with a complete and truthful explanation?
If I did that, I'd have to tell them the names of my tenants, and then I'd have made all kinds of hassles for them that they didn't need. Even though they stiffed me on a couple of months of electricity, that really doesn't compare with having to go to court.
“It is certainly sad and regrettable that so many innocent people died…Stalin was absolutely adamant on making doubly sure: spare no one…I don’t deny that I supported that view. I was simply not able to study every individual case…It was hard to draw a precise line where to stop.”

Vyacheslav Mikhailovich Skryabin (“Molotov”)

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:14 pm

This one raised my hackles in a big way ...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47143135
This from a man who advocates the overriding of the Good Friday Agreement. Hypocritical bastard! Especially as he represents an organisation which has no recognisable procedures in place for any member state to leave the EU. Pots and kettles, Donald! Doubly especially as he obviously hadn't looked at these documents before opening his mouth ...
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... pean-union

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Re: Brexit

Post by landrew » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:12 pm

Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:25 am
landrew wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:50 pm
Upton_O_Goode wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:27 pm
Poodle wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:06 pm
I trust you kept the coins?
Actually, no. I wanted to conceal the crime, not profit by it. Mainly, I didn't want to have to explain what the hell a parking meter was doing in my basement the next time I had the furnace worked on.
Did it ever occur to you to turn it into the police with a complete and truthful explanation?
If I did that, I'd have to tell them the names of my tenants, and then I'd have made all kinds of hassles for them that they didn't need. Even though they stiffed me on a couple of months of electricity, that really doesn't compare with having to go to court.
I hope it doesn't put you in legal jeopardy now that you've disclosed it.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:49 pm

I think he'll be safe, landrew. There's no evidence left and, besides, I can't see US v Upton O'Goode getting very far.

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Re: Brexit

Post by landrew » Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:30 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:49 pm
I think he'll be safe, landrew. There's no evidence left and, besides, I can't see US v Upton O'Goode getting very far.
No evidence, no crime?
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:45 pm

No evidence, no proof. I think UoG may not be about to go down to the local police and confess his mortal sin.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:53 pm

In the meantime, Leo Varadkar has been giggling behind his hands at Donald Tusk's extraordinary outburst and is now taking it upon himself to taunt the UK. He seems to think that it is the UK who are breaking the Good Friday Agreement - just how he thinks that is happening is beyond all reckoning. However, the Tusk and Varadkar double act has incensed several Euro-active politicians here and, to be frank, they've probably also incensed a goodly proportion of the UK population. What they seem to forget is that a no-deal Brexit is still a strong possibility. Nigel Farrage is laughing his socks off right now and rubbing his hands with glee.
How bloody stupid can politicians get?

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:46 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:53 pm
How bloody stupid can politicians get?
Mark Twain said something like: "Most people think of Politicians as honest but dumb whereas the truth is just the opposite." keeping this in mind, I'd assume your dumb politicians are working towards their own goals................
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:36 pm

OK - here's the logic ...
The UK and the Republic of Ireland signed the Good Friday Agreement and, since then, there has been no border on the island of Ireland. Although eased by the fact that both the UK and the Republic of Ireland joined the EU at the same time, the lack of border is first and foremost a result of the GFA - it is NOT a result of the EU open border policy as it was already open when both the UK and the Republic joined the EU - that's two independent states co-operating about an open border, so it has already been shown to be possible. The UK has repeated time and again that no matter what its relationship with the EU, it has no intention of erecting a hard border, insisting that there are other means of monitoring traffic across that border. Leo Varadkar, the President of the Republic of Ireland, has also stated that he has no intention of erecting a hard border. All well and good - the criteria of the Good Friday Agreement are satisfied.
The EU come along and insist upon a backstop (a continuance of the EU terms and conditions of trade) in Northern Ireland. Although highly unpopular in the UK that condition COULD be tolerated as long as there is a time limit upon it, The EU refuse to put a time limit on it and, therefore, the UK Parliament (understandably) has said that there cannot be a backstop. Two days ago, Varadkar also thought that a time-limited backstop could work. Only one agency insists that there cannot be a time limit.
The UK has not shifted its position - one that has been shown to be fully effective - since the GFA came into existence. Now, however, Varadkar is angrily accusing the UK of imperilling the GFA.
Well, no, Mr Varadkar - it is YOU who has altered your position as you now insist that there must be a hard border simply because the EU have told you so. Sorry, but that is no doing of the UK. Varadkar's venom should be reserved for his real enemies - the EU Commission and, now, Donald Tusk, who have manoeuvred him into an untenable position for which he turns the blame onto the UK. Varadkar can erect a border if he wants to (although he swore that he wouldn't) but that will be HIS doing, not that of the UK, and any resultant loss of life will be HIS responsibility and, by a process of association, that of the EU.
When he reviews the images of himself and Donald Tusk giggling about Tusk's 'Brexiteers without a plan' fiasco, I hope he appreciates the damage that the pair of them have just done to the Brexit negotiations. They have virtually guaranteed a no-deal exit for the UK, with all the resultant damage to the EU that entails. Fools - there's no other word for it.

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:41 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:36 pm
They have virtually guaranteed a no-deal exit for the UK, with all the resultant damage to the EU that entails. Fools - there's no other word for it.
What might that damage be?
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:47 pm

As you have been told at least a dozen times, bobbo, £39 billion of damage - plus a comic demonstration of how much the word of the EU Commission is worth.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Tom Palven » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:56 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:53 pm
How bloody stupid can politicians get?
The fact that they persist on driving on the left-hand side of the road shows that they are hopeless.

Dumb beyond words.

Say no more. Any other stupidity is just icing on the cake.
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Re: Brexit

Post by TJrandom » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:08 pm

Tom Palven wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:56 pm
Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:53 pm
How bloody stupid can politicians get?
The fact that they persist on driving on the left-hand side of the road shows that they are hopeless.

Dumb beyond words.

Say no more. Any other stupidity is just icing on the cake.
Tom, I thought that you were opposed to the US imposing its views and practices on the world.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:20 pm

landrew wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:30 pm
Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:49 pm
I think he'll be safe, landrew. There's no evidence left and, besides, I can't see US v Upton O'Goode getting very far.
No evidence, no crime?
That was 30 years ago. I throw myself on the Statute of Limitations.
“It is certainly sad and regrettable that so many innocent people died…Stalin was absolutely adamant on making doubly sure: spare no one…I don’t deny that I supported that view. I was simply not able to study every individual case…It was hard to draw a precise line where to stop.”

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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:23 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:36 pm
OK - here's the logic ...
The UK and the Republic of Ireland signed the Good Friday Agreement and, since then, there has been no border on the island of Ireland. Although eased by the fact that both the UK and the Republic of Ireland joined the EU at the same time, the lack of border is first and foremost a result of the GFA - it is NOT a result of the EU open border policy as it was already open when both the UK and the Republic joined the EU - that's two independent states co-operating about an open border, so it has already been shown to be possible. The UK has repeated time and again that no matter what its relationship with the EU, it has no intention of erecting a hard border, insisting that there are other means of monitoring traffic across that border. Leo Varadkar, the President of the Republic of Ireland, has also stated that he has no intention of erecting a hard border. All well and good - the criteria of the Good Friday Agreement are satisfied.
The EU come along and insist upon a backstop (a continuance of the EU terms and conditions of trade) in Northern Ireland. Although highly unpopular in the UK that condition COULD be tolerated as long as there is a time limit upon it, The EU refuse to put a time limit on it and, therefore, the UK Parliament (understandably) has said that there cannot be a backstop. Two days ago, Varadkar also thought that a time-limited backstop could work. Only one agency insists that there cannot be a time limit.
The UK has not shifted its position - one that has been shown to be fully effective - since the GFA came into existence. Now, however, Varadkar is angrily accusing the UK of imperilling the GFA.
Well, no, Mr Varadkar - it is YOU who has altered your position as you now insist that there must be a hard border simply because the EU have told you so. Sorry, but that is no doing of the UK. Varadkar's venom should be reserved for his real enemies - the EU Commission and, now, Donald Tusk, who have manoeuvred him into an untenable position for which he turns the blame onto the UK. Varadkar can erect a border if he wants to (although he swore that he wouldn't) but that will be HIS doing, not that of the UK, and any resultant loss of life will be HIS responsibility and, by a process of association, that of the EU.
When he reviews the images of himself and Donald Tusk giggling about Tusk's 'Brexiteers without a plan' fiasco, I hope he appreciates the damage that the pair of them have just done to the Brexit negotiations. They have virtually guaranteed a no-deal exit for the UK, with all the resultant damage to the EU that entails. Fools - there's no other word for it.
What goes through their minds? Mine boggles, just hearing about the things they have said. Seven weeks + to go. Tick, tick, tick....
“It is certainly sad and regrettable that so many innocent people died…Stalin was absolutely adamant on making doubly sure: spare no one…I don’t deny that I supported that view. I was simply not able to study every individual case…It was hard to draw a precise line where to stop.”

Vyacheslav Mikhailovich Skryabin (“Molotov”)

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:51 pm

Poodle wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:47 pm
As you have been told at least a dozen times, bobbo, £39 billion of damage - plus a comic demonstration of how much the word of the EU Commission is worth.
Thanks poodle. Is it trigger words, or just...........?

Thats it?...........as I assumed on an earlier post.....much of that 30 billion just goes back to the EU members as social services? So, its going to be mostly a wash? and with food and medicine going up 30%....how long to recoupe whatever it cost?

Like so many people thinking below their means.........you are only "always" doing half the equation. The other half of the equation the EU gets is a huge stick against the other EU members giving them reason not to leave. States leaving a union are an EXISTENTIAL THREAT to its existence.

Being pragmatic, if "I" were the EU....I'd put the UK hard up against the wall and fart in their general direction.

"The EU said........." //// Wut??? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Right here is where to two cocks come into play. UK taking the "word" of an unsubjugated political entity? Tell me it ain't so????? All primitives make that mistake......usually at the hands of the UK. Amusing such a complaint is even uttered.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:47 am

I posted the bit below only a few days ago ...

"The Malthouse Compromise - remember that name. It's a proposal which has become popular in Parliament, and involves a technologically-controlled border, an extension of the transition period until 2021, and "... the prime minister would renegotiate the backstop element of her Brexit deal to replace it with a free trade agreement"."

I know about it, and all of the people who are reading this thread know about it. As the words imply, it is a plan in the form of a proposal. It is not the only proposal in existence - there have been several (including the ultimate no-deal Brexit). Donald Tusk either does not know about it or he had a severe amnesia attack yesterday. Jacob Rees Mogg has already responded with a quip about Tusk venturing into religious territory whilst being ignorant of the 9th Commandment ... "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour".
[Cynicism on] I feel sure that Tusk will feel obliged to issue an abject apology at some point today [Cynicism off].

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:39 am

Mrs May is off to Brussels again today, which brings up the age-old question ...
What DOES happen when an irresistible force meets an immovable barrier?

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:21 am

Michel Barnier, Senior Brexit Negotiator for the EU, has stated that the EU27 (that's every EU member except the UK) is united in its opposition to concessions to the UK over the backstop arrangements.
Meanwhile, the Foreign Minister of Poland (one of those 27) Jacek Czaputowicz, who has been attempting to break the deadlock for some time, has said that Irish intransigence has resulted in a “game of chicken with two cars hurtling toward each other, and we will have a frontal collision. As a consequence, Ireland will lose most and it will have the duty of organising the EU external border with Northern Ireland.”
There are several possible explanations ...
1. Jacek Czaputowicz is not really the Foreign Minister of Poland.
2. Poland is not really a member of the EU.
3. Michel Barnier is economical with the truth.
4. I dreamt all of this.
I'm struggling to make a choice.

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Re: Brexit

Post by OutOfBreath » Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:10 am

Poodle, you do seem to be needlessly hyperbolic and tabloid about your constant descriptions and characterizations of the involved parties. The EU position is simply that the UK cant pick and choose which freedoms it will have or not from the EU charter. (This would cause endless troubles for the EU in the future as other coutnries would try for the same) That has all 27 behind it, more or less. (although there will be politicians from EU countries that make statements that differ from the official position) Furthermore, since having 27 parties be onboard with a position, it will tend to be adamantly insisted upon in negotiations with a third party. The commission has the job of doing that.

The UK has been cocking up it's own position for 2 years, and are still doing so, although they now seem to be verging on reason and realizing they have to go for something that can have a parliamentary majority. May has cocked this up by picking up some "red lines" from the hardline brexiteers, that never were going to work if market access were to be maintained unscathed. A soft brexit that has the backing of others than the conservative party is what can win through. That means binning various sovereignty posturing and accepting quite a bit of free movement anyway.

That the EU is capable of uniting behind "playing hardball" with the UK just shows how ineptly the UK has handled this. No small feat given how EU countries are prone to splinter and disagree on most things.

Point is, this Barnier fellow may well be a cock of the highest order, but he's not the one who made this situation. That was made by a conservative party trying to fend off a civil war among it's own ranks. The solution will be that May stops worrying about keeping the (in reality splintered) party together, and start working on a deal that can unite enough of parliament (read: be stomachable to remainers).

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:14 am

Well, Dan, I feel I have to inform you of the error of your ways. The UK is leaving the EU. It matters not one whit what I feel about that or, indeed what anyone else feels about it. It is an undeniable fact. All that remains is to salvage what can be salvaged from a long but now moribund relationship. All is fair in that salvage operation apart from blatant lying - and that is where Donald Tusk went (shamefully) yesterday. I'm a little surprised at your statement ..."This would cause endless troubles for the EU in the future as other coutnries would try for the same" ... as it appears to be an admission that all is not well within the bureaucrat-led organisation which the EU has become.
Simply saying that Barnier is not the maker of the situation is disingenuous - he has been and remains one of the prime movers.
Here are the facts - the UK is, following the mandate prescribed by a referendum, leaving the EU. That is the very simple and irreversible fact. The UK is exercising one of its rights as an EU member. How dare they!!! The UK is, in fact, following through on a simple concept called democracy (against which as far as I'm concerned, at least, there can be no argument). The UK is now the object of a barrage of threats and, after yesterday, lies about their position. That is unforgivable. The UK government is obliged by UK law to negotiate with the EU the best (ie most advantageous) deal it can strike. The EU Commission have precisely the same brief. Even so, the UK government has not yet stooped to the depths of insult and untruth. I wish I could say the same of the EU Commission.
Even you have reiterated the much-vaunted fairy tale of the unity of the 27, despite what I just posted about Poland. That leaves me gobsmacked and, strangely enough, is the kind of thing which has gobsmacked a high proportion of the UK population for several years.
Given my druthers, I would at this moment in time summarily cut off all contact with a continent suffering almost pathological delusions about what are the more important things about actually existing as humans. The Earth is not a big shop. There are more important things than commerce. If that attitude makes the UK persona non grata within the EU, then so be it. I know where I'd rather stand.
All in all, Dan, the recent behaviour of the body which the EU as a whole has entrusted to negotiate Brexit has transformed my attitudes and opinions. From being a regretful leaver, I have become a 'can't wait to get out' kind of person. I feel that I really don't want to belong to any supranational organisation in which blatant lying is not only entrenched but encouraged. There's really nothing more to say. Goodbye, EU, and good riddance.

EDIT: I have been watching the European press for a few hours now. NOWHERE have I found (except in the UK press) a single condemnation of Donald Tusk's outrageous behaviour yesterday. I do not feel, Dan, that there can be any defence of such a situation. The UK is much better off not belonging to an organisation which feels it does not have to censure Tusk's behaviour. That, I'm afraid, is the end of the story.

But it may be worth watching Katya Adler's roundup of the situation (it's down at the bottom of this article) ...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47152035

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 12:42 pm

Actually, Dan, I owe you an apology. That isn't really what I meant to say at all.
What I'm trying to do is point out to everyone what allowing an out-of-control bureaucracy to gain executive authority can do. The EU Commission is anathema to me and I feel its current behaviour should be a warning to every lover of democracy and freedom in the entire world. I no longer feel threatened - we're leaving - but I feel for the remaining members.
Eschewing all hyperbolae but remaining a little on the tabloid side, chucking that load of shits off the UK boat is the best thing that could happen. In my humble opinion, of course. I would wonder, though, how anyone can think that the Presidency of the European Council is an appropriate platform from which to wish anyone in Hell.
I am a little puzzled by "That the EU is capable of uniting behind "playing hardball" with the UK just shows how ineptly the UK has handled this". As I've already pointed out, it isn't united behind "playing hardball" and has never been so. You make the common error of believing that what the Commission says is, de facto, the truth. In my experience, it rarely is. Ask the people of Greece, Italy, and Hungary, amongst others, about that.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:57 pm

In fact, apologies to all - I do get overheated on this subject.

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Re: Brexit

Post by bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:07 pm

Plus...........some people here egged you on with their own intransigence on several points. Just saying...............
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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:15 pm

Mrs May has completed her talks in Brussels - at least for today. She got nothing from Juncker at all except a repetition of what he's said before. She also had words with Donald Tusk, who was completely and utterly unrepentant about his stupid (is that an OK word?) outburst last night. Basically, she's wasting her time. Surely she must now begin no-deal procedures as, without a complete reversal of the will of Parliament, that's what is going to happen anyway.
EDIT: I've just been looking around all the commentators I can find who don't have an obvious political axe to grind. The general feeling coming from them is that Tusk's ignorance combined with the brick wall reception Theresa May got today has served only to bolster the conviction that a no-deal Brexit is now a virtual certainty whether or not the stance on the Irish backstop is softened. Any blinking of the part of the Commission is going to be too little too late.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Poodle » Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:50 pm

I'm not at all sure if any of you can watch this, but it's worth it if you can. It's Jacob Rees Mogg's vision for the UK outside the EU. He may often be a figure of fun, but he's as sharp as a knife when it comes to vision and policy.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b ... -on-brexit

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Re: Brexit

Post by Upton_O_Goode » Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:26 pm

Poodle wrote:
Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:50 pm
I'm not at all sure if any of you can watch this, but it's worth it if you can. It's Jacob Rees Mogg's vision for the UK outside the EU. He may often be a figure of fun, but he's as sharp as a knife when it comes to vision and policy.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b ... -on-brexit
I can watch it if I register. I'm always reluctant to sign up for any web service, even one as benign as the BBC. I'll bet I can find some of what he says by just googling his name.

Ah yes, there is much material out there for easy viewing.

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Re: Brexit

Post by TJrandom » Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:37 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol: