"I see no evidens"

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:07 am

Iz there an estimate uv how much haz been taken by all the oligarks?

I recall reading sumthing about the world'z larjest consentration uv billionairez being in Moscow. Seeing that the Russian economy iz not very big, a billion dollarz iz still alot there.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:31 am

JO 753 wrote:Iz there an estimate uv how much haz been taken by all the oligarks?
Again, that's a hard question. Do we value the stolen assets at the time they were stolen at a realistic 1991 international value or, as per the 1991 Russian economy's value? Obviously it's the international value, but then we are mixing up foreign capital from stock exchanges when they were floated outside of Russia. Generally the Russian courts can only recover physical assets that still remain in Russia, like oil fields, mining rights and so forth.
JO 753 wrote:I recall reading sumthing about the world'z larjest consentration uv billionairez being in Moscow. Seeing that the Russian economy iz not very big, a billion dollarz iz still alot there.
You got it. Although the Russian economy looks small if you directly compare a rouble to a US dollar, that same rouble buys four times as much in Russia if you use Purchasing Power Parity comparisons.

Mikhail Khodorkovsky / Yukos Oil
In 2003, Khodorkovsky was believed to be the wealthiest man in Russia (with a fortune estimated to be worth $15 billion) and was ranked 16th on Forbes list of billionaires. He had worked his way up the Komsomol apparatus during the Soviet years, and started several businesses during the period of glasnost and perestroika in the late 1980s. After the dissolution of the Soviet Union, in the mid-1990s, he accumulated considerable wealth through obtaining control of a series of Siberian oil fields unified under the name Yukos, one of the major companies to emerge from the privatization of state assets during the 1990s (a scheme known as "Loans for Shares").

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Khodorkovsky

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:27 am

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:14 pm

Hey! Its still there! They usually dont stay up this long.

Anyway, that got me to thinking and I rote this in Daily Kos:
Open Letter To Robert Mueller

Alternate title: Treason Step 3.

Dear Mr. Mueller,

With the Executive being the perpetrator of the crime and the party in control of both Congress and the Senate openly working to protect the criminal from your investigation, it is apparent that the system created by the founding fathers has failed. The system is now under the indirect, but effective control of a hostile foreign power.

The Republicans have a realistic shot at thwarting you and the intelligence agencies and enabling Putin to continue to direct his puppet to damage the Nation any way he can. With their propaganda partners clearly succeeding in deceiving a significant fraction of the citizenry into believing that you and the intel agencies are part of a ‘deep state’ conspiracy and a Republican majority Supreme Court with a record of partisan decisions, who is left to deliver your final report to?

I believe you will need to deliver it to We, The People before the conspirators can take action to hide it from us.

They have been working assiduously to establish a story of corruption by the investigators, so will surely attempt to twist, tear and mangle your report into a shape that supports that story. Giving them the opportunity and time to do so requires your cooperation, which is accomplished simply by you following the standard proceedure. They will keep it hidden from the American public while working on it with Trump and Putin, only releasing their own report, supposedly about it, that is tailored to suit their purpose.

You need to release it to Rachel Maddow, The Washington Post, The New York Times, The Chicago Tribune, The LA Times, etc. BEFORE passing it up to your ‘superiors’ in the Justice Department. And the sooner the better, while there is still an FBI that will continue the investigation.
Obama going 'by the book' wuz a huje mistake. He put the consern uv The Prezident appearing to be interfering in the election over the danjer uv a forin adversary ACTUALLY interfering in the election!

Now Mueller seemz to be going 'by the book' to the extreem, taking the time to cross all the Tz and dot all the iz, conserned that Trump's defens will uze any little foible to keep him out uv jail. The potential danjer iz that they will kill hiz investigation, or fill the courts with puppet jujez befor he puts a pretty bow on hiz report.

I usually go by 'wut do I know? I'm just a dumass on the internet' and expect the peepl on the job to know wut they are doing. Haznt been the case lately.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by OlegTheBatty » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:41 pm

Haven't you noticed that the Trumpster hasn't fared too well in the courts lately? Minor stuff like injunctions and civil suits so far, but it still bodes poorly for him.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Aztexan » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:08 pm

Can bullets distinguish between hostile, foreign enemies of the state and say maybe, certain individuals in a certain political party who may enable said hostile, foreign enemies of the state to attempt a takeover?
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:10 pm

I did notis, but we are tokking about the demize uv democrasy spredding to the US. Az I rote in the article : "They have a realistic shot", even if its a long shot.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Aztexan » Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:52 pm

https://www.yahoo.com/news/robert-muell ... 00469.html

[Insert emoticon masturbating furiously to smartphone]
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:59 pm

The author haz an optimistic view, but dont forget Trump wuz expected to looz the election by a landslide.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:28 pm

JO 753 wrote:The author haz an optimistic view, but dont forget Trump wuz expected to looz the election by a landslide.
I'd hang on for the ride. It appear Mueller is going to bring all the money laundering cases together first, to force plea bargain evidence and then review his evidence to see where he can go next with strong court room evidence.

I am very impressed so far. Mueller is quiet, doesn't leak, is methodical and doing us all, in many countries, a big favour.

I like Russia but Russia is being too bold at the moment. If (and I mean "if") Putin has been displaying his skill to impress the upper political echelons in Russia, for the 2018 Russian election, Putin may calm down after March 2018. Putin would first make friendly moves to Germany, as it it Germany and the EC that he wants to bond with economically.
:D

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by OlegTheBatty » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:03 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
JO 753 wrote:The author haz an optimistic view, but dont forget Trump wuz expected to looz the election by a landslide.
I'd hang on for the ride. It appear Mueller is going to bring all the money laundering cases together first, to force plea bargain evidence and then review his evidence to see where he can go next with strong court room evidence.

I am very impressed so far. Mueller is quiet, doesn't leak, is methodical and doing us all, in many countries, a big favour.

I like Russia but Russia is being too bold at the moment. If (and I mean "if") Putin has been displaying his skill to impress the upper political echelons in Russia, for the 2018 Russian election, Putin may calm down after March 2018. Putin would first make friendly moves to Germany, as it it Germany and the EC that he wants to bond with economically.
:D
Sure. The US meddling is just a sideshow to him. Low cost, few people, and lotsa giggles. Why would he stop?
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:15 pm

OlegTheBatty wrote: Sure. The US meddling (by Putin) is just a sideshow to him. Low cost, few people, and lotsa giggles. Why would he stop?
I think that's going to be "Part II". Once Sergey Naryshkin determines that people are picking up that Russian propaganda is,indeed, Russian propaganda, he will release information slowly showing evidence of Russia collusion with Trump. That will confuse the remaining current Trump fans and keep the USA politically confused and inward looking, for years.

Sergey Naryshkin ran Russia TV One and knows media tricks.
:D

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:25 pm

I think that will only happen if Trump duz sumthing Putin duznt like.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:27 pm

Mother Jonez. Trump's 2013 Moskow adventure.
Trump was finally on his way in Russia. And shortly after the Miss Universe event, Agalarov’s daughter showed up at the Miss Universe office in New York City bearing a gift for Trump from Putin. It was a black lacquered box. Inside was a sealed letter from the Russian autocrat. What the letter said has never been revealed.
Wy do you think Mr. Shameless Braggart woud not be Trumpeting hiz special messaj from hiz hero to the world? Completely out uv karakter for the guy who puts framed picturez uv himself everywhere. A man so desperate for adulation that he put framed picturez uv hiz inaguaration az Prezident up 2 dayz afterward bogusly claiming 'the biggest crowd ever'!

Yet here he gets a sealed letter in a fansy black laquered box hand delivered and he keeps it a secret. Hmmm.

Gotta be bad. REEEELLY FREEKIN BAD!

My gess: It wuz to inform him uv all the Kompromat Putin haz on him. A document uv ownership. 'You are my puppet.'
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:00 pm

Firing Tillerson iz obviously a Putin puppeteer move.

Various disagreements never rezulted in Trump axing him bekuz Tillerson wuz Putin'z pik for Secretary uv State. Tillerson even got away with calling Trump a F***ing moron! Az soon az he sided with England that Putin iz the culprit for the poizoned Russian spy - BLAM! Fired!
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Tom Palven » Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:02 pm

But his appointment for CIA director is a great choice (Probably not his.) to slap the world silly and make it toe the line, or at least make a pathetic attempt at it.
https://www.aol.com/article/news/2018/0 ... /23384456/
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:18 pm

The mail version uv Debbie Lusnutigan:

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Tom Palven » Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:05 pm

JO 753 wrote:The mail version uv Debbie Lusnutigan:

Yeah, you're right, and as you might expect, I like this guy.

However, as I've said many a time, since the days when Eisenhower warned us about the MIC it doesn't matter who wins the Presidency anymore.

I'm not thrilled to accept it or say it, but The Agency now runs this country (And thus the World for the time being, whether Agent 008 can grasp that or reconcile with that, or not.)
http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/03 ... s-m13.html

Let's see if the Deep State allows Trump to talk to Kim Jong Un in the next few weeks.

It's my kinda falsifiable hypothesis that the Deep State will not.

If Trump doesn't talk to Kim that will provide some evidens of a powerful Deep State, although it wouldn't be proof of one.
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:39 pm

Aside from the exessiv foul langwij, I like him also. And the video effect uv the background TV iz kool.

Hillary & the Demz goofed up wen they didnt pik Bernie az the VP, but he iz rong that she lost kuz she wuz less popular than Trump. She won the popular vote. Blame Alexander Hamilton for Trump.

Herez a Q for the experts: Wuts the maximum differential between the popular vote and the electoral collej winner?
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:19 pm

Tom Palven wrote:But his appointment for CIA director is a great choice
Gina Haspel has already been working at the CIA since 1985. She is already known as an idiot, internationally. as she ran the CIA's Directorate of Operations and kept screwing up.

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Tom Palven » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:35 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Tom Palven wrote:But his appointment for CIA director is a great choice
Gina Haspel has already been working at the CIA since 1985. She is already known as an idiot, internationally. as she ran the CIA's Directorate of Operations and kept screwing up.
Another good job, Agent 008! A partial sentence out of context to create a false imprsssion.

The kind of disinformation BS that secret police can be proud of!
If one can be taught to believe absurdities, one can commit atrocities. --Voltaire

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:48 pm

Tom Palven wrote:But his (Trump's) appointment for CIA director (Gina Haspel) is a great choice
Matthew Ellard wrote:Gina Haspel has already been working at the CIA since 1985. She is already known as an idiot, internationally. as she ran the CIA's Directorate of Operations and kept screwing up.
Tom Palven wrote: Another good job, Agent 008! A partial sentence out of context to create a false imprsssion.
What's an "imprsssion"?

Are you denying Gina Haspel has been working at the CIA since 1985 and run the CIA's foreign operations?

Aren't you the same idiot who claimed the CIA ran the world? So why is Gina Haspel a great choice"?

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:34 am

Sanctionz being enacted. 60 Spyz being deported. Co-ordination with aliez.

I prognosticate embarrassing info about Trump in Russia to appear this week. It wont be everything, or the biggest thing bekuz it iz intended to get Trump back in line, not ruin him.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:11 pm

Russian oligark's son in law iz the 1st person going to the slammer. From wuts in that article, I dont no if he wuz directly involved in the Trumputin conspirasy, but it woudnt suprize me if more about him or the law firm he wuz in surfasez later.

If British law iz anything like it iz here, he will also be disbarred.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by scrmbldggs » Wed Apr 04, 2018 7:43 pm

:| FAUX Noise found... evidence.

Apparently it is reporting this as a serious and sincere apology. :laff:
.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Sat Apr 14, 2018 5:41 am

2 hypothosis on the Syria strikes and I dont know wich iz more likely:

1. Putin gave the go-ahed to Trump. Hiz advantaj iz that he can sell more weponz to Asad, maybe even get him so far in det that Putin basicly ownz Syria.

Trump iz uzing it az a distraction from wuts going on with Muellerz investigation.

or

2. Trump knowz the gig iz up on all the dirt Putin haz on him anyway kuz uv the Cohen raid, so he duznt care if Putin lets out the pee tape & wutevr other leveraj he had. He wants to get a few punchez in agenst Putin befor the hammer drops.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Sat May 19, 2018 6:06 pm

Watergate rezulted in 69 inditements.

I predict there will be over 150 for TrumPutin. Its up to 23 so far with 5 gilty pleaz and 1 guy serving time alredy.

Thats not a simple number tho. 13 are Russianz who arent likely to be extradited and 3 are Russian companyz comprized uv many individualz.

Then, if you're counting inditement charjez insted uv indited peepl, the number jumps way up bekuz each person haz several counts. Manafort, for example, haz 32 counts!
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Tom Palven » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:45 am

Mueller wants to limit his own evidens?

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-06- ... show-court
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:03 pm

I bet that works on alot uv Trump fanz. They barely hav the attention span to read the hedline, let alone the article.

Not that reading further iz likely to help, kuz therez no chans they coud see thru the spin or liez.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Jun 14, 2018 3:22 am

Tom Palven wrote:Mueller wants to limit his own evidens?
For pre-trial you idiot. Learn to read.

The prosecution is not required to disclose evidence at pre-trial, if it is not relevant to the case being prosecuted , but may bring the same evidence up, at the actual trial, in rebuttal of a claim by the defense during trial.

As the prosecution already has presented other evidence, strong enough to go to trial, he does not have to hand over other evidence that he may use in a separate charge or if the prosecutor can argue the disclosure of irrelevant evidence at pre-trial may allow the defense to hide that evidence in the interim period between pre-trial and trial.

This is how evidence laws work.

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:35 pm

Herez sumthing to think about:

How likely iz it that Putin shut down hiz wildly seksesful election interferens operation for the mid-termz? Or at least scaled it down to nearly nothing?

Wut if it wuz just much sneekyer? In the interest uv getting away with it, he didnt do anything to call attention to the rezults - just tweeked them in sum key rasez, just enuf to keep hiz puppet in the Oval Ofis.

In other wordz, he coud hav had the GoPs win every rase, completely taken over Congress and all the other offisez that were voted on, but that woud be so obvious that it woud fors action.

Insted, let the Demz take the house, but just enuf to keep from razing suspicion. Sum uv the Guvernorz rasez that were close, tweek them to put the GoP ahed by a small amount. The Senate wuz alwayz seen az likely to stay in GoP handz, so just make sure.

A solid stratejy.
Its wut I woud do.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 2:10 am

JO 753 wrote:How likely iz it that Putin shut down hiz wildly seksesful election interferens operation for the mid-termz? Or at least scaled it down to nearly nothing?
It's not Putin the individual. It is the SVR (Russian Foreign Intelligence Service) and GRU (Russian Military Intelligence Service) as instructed by the Security Council of Russia.

Although I think the Russians have some more long term "plays" in the making, to keep the USA in a politically chaotic state, I don't think they had much to do with the mid terms.

Secondly, I think they know they can only get "results" playing with Trump, Trump's image and Trump will be gone soon. There are sensible people in both the democrats and republican parties and they will eventually unify to eradicate Russian interference.

My current guess is that the Russians are trying to make the USA and EC hate each other, so that the EC will drop sanctions against Russia, import Iranian oil , get into a trade war and throw the USA out of NATO.

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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by JO 753 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:22 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 2:10 am
It's not Putin the individual. It is the SVR (Russian Foreign Intelligence Service) and GRU (Russian Military Intelligence Service) as instructed by the Security Council of Russia.
Az I understand it, nothing happenz in Russia without Putinz approval. Not that he'z micromanajing everything, but he sets the ajenda.
Although I think the Russians have some more long term "plays" in the making, to keep the USA in a politically chaotic state, I don't think they had much to do with the mid terms.
That you hav that impression can support my hypothosis. So low key that nobody suspects.
There are sensible people in both the democrats and republican parties
Few & far between in the GoP. Even fewer now kuz sum uv the relatively sensible wunz are quitting.
My current guess is that the Russians are trying to make the USA and EC hate each other, so that the EC will drop sanctions against Russia, import Iranian oil , get into a trade war and throw the USA out of NATO.
Anything the weakenz the US iz good for Russia. Trump reneging on the deal with Iran turnz us into the bad guy!
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by landrew » Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:50 pm

Where's Gord the Grammar cop?
He should be having a field day here.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Gord » Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:58 pm

I don't read this thread 'cause I don't need to see no evidens.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:00 pm

JO 753 wrote: Az I understand it, nothing happenz in Russia without Putinz approval. Not that he'z micromanajing everything, but he sets the ajenda.
Approval on paper, is a different thing to continuous input and day to day management. Putin's mind is a bit distracted with a real domestic issue. Putin wants to increase the pension age to 65 in a country where the average life expectancy is only 67.

I would think that Putin does have a day to day management input, concerning political manipulations in Germany, the EU and the USA. However I don't think he had direct input into the GRU's ( Army Intelligence) attempted assassination of Sergei Skripal. I say that because the intelligence services under Putin's direct control were unaware that BBC TV crews were visiting the birth cities of the GRU officers that made the assassination attempt.

Its a bit like the US Army intelligence ( which is small and not experienced in assassinations) doing an assassination and forgetting to tell the CIA and FBI what it was doing..........although it had done the same thing thirty years ago in the past.

Back to the USA / Russian Meddling
I don't think the Russians are making any effort to "push in" the Republican Party at all at the moment.. I think the Russians are going out of their way to keep Republicans and Democrats hating each other. This simply distracts the USA from looking at international matters where the Russians are currently doing things.


The British did this in the 18th century in India and the middle East. The British would fund two political groups that hated each other simultaneously. and then sell both sides weapons, or march in as peacemakers.

In a weird way this is what happened in Syria, but it all went wrong. The USA funded the anti-Assad rebels and promised them support. The rebels bought USA weapons. However Russia marched in as peacemakers and ended to civil war. Now Russia will sell weapons to Syria.

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Gord
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Gord » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:03 pm

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 2:10 am
Although I think the Russians have some more long term "plays" in the making, to keep the USA in a politically chaotic state, I don't think they had much to do with the mid terms.
They appear to have kept their fingers in the pot: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/11/07/faceboo ... terms.html
Facebook blocked more than 100 Facebook and Instagram accounts with potential ties to a so-called Russian "troll farm" ahead of the U.S. midterm elections, the company said Wednesday.

The firm said it received a tip-off from law enforcement about the accounts, which it says may be linked to Russia's Internet Research Agency (IRA), one of the groups that was indicted earlier this year over allegations it interfered in the 2016 presidential election.
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Matthew Ellard » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:04 pm

Gord wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:58 pm
I don't read this thread 'cause I don't need to see no evidens.
Ahhh yes.......but what about the non-evidence, you didn't see that is good evidence that non-evidence is indeed non-evidence.

Hmmmmmm...... :D

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Gord
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by Gord » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:42 pm

I don't believe in non-evidence. I'm an anon-evidenceist.
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"Imagine an ennobling of what could be" -- the New Age BS Generator site
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Re: "I see no evidens"

Post by landrew » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:52 pm

"Evidence? what evidence? "
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The job of a skeptic is to investigate the unexplained; not to explain the uninvestigated.