Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

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Shen1986
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Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby Shen1986 » Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:07 am

I found this article. Called Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked. I decided to have a look at it. Here you can find the whole article: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.com.au ... unked.html

Here is a part of the article:

Scientific evidence refuting the theory of modern humanity’s African genesis is common knowledge among those familiar with the most recent scientific papers on the human Genome, Mitochondrial DNA and Y-chromosomes. Regrettably, within mainstream press and academia circles, there seems to be a conspicuous – and dare we say it – deliberate vacuum when it comes to reporting news of these recent studies and their obvious implications.


Australian historian Greg Jefferys explains that, "The whole ‘Out of Africa’ myth has its roots in the mainstream academic campaign in the 1990′s to remove the concept of Race. When I did my degree they all spent a lot of time on the ‘Out of Africa’ thing but it’s been completely disproved by genetics. Mainstream still hold on to it."

It did begin the early 90’s. And the academics most responsible for cementing both the Out-of Africa theory and the complementary common ancestral African mother – given the name of “Eve” – in the public arena and nearly every curriculum, were Professors Alan C. Wilson and Rebecca L. Cann.

In their defense, the authors of this paper were fully aware that genealogy is not in any way linked to geography, and that their placement of Eve in Africa was an assumption, never an assertion.

A very recent paper on Y-chromosomes published in 2012, (Re-Examing the “Out of Africa” Theory and the Origin of Europeoids (Caucasians) in the Light of DNA Genealogy written by Anatole A. Klyosov and Igor L. Rozhanski) only confirms the denial of any African ancestry in non-Africans, and strongly supports the existence of a “common ancestor” who “would not necessarily be in Africa. In fact, it was never proven that he lived in Africa.”


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.com.au ... unked.html

I decided to have a skeptical look at it so here goes:

1. Problem: The site Atlantean Gardens gives me quite a skeptical feeling about it. They have strange articles here like claiming that Vril was real:

In 1871 Sir Edward Bulwer-Lytton published a novel entitled Vril: The Power Of The Coming Race about a subterranean civilization able to utilise a powerful force or earth energy called 'Vril'. This energy could be used for good or ill, to heal or to destroy (similar to Prana, Chi, Orgone).

The novel was a huge success in its time, and is credited with giving rise to the Science Fiction Genre. However, it is rarely read today, Lytton's prose style being incompatible with modern taste.

This can be seen from an annual competition, run by a Californian University, known as 'The Bulwer-Lytton Fiction Contest'. The one condition of entry is 'to compose the opening sentence to the worst of all possible novels'.

Joke-worthy as the book may be now, its influence at the time cannot be downplayed. And it was Bulwer-Lytton's professed interest in all things occult that led to speculation that this work of fiction was really based on fact, i.e. that Vril is a real force or energy.


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... ytton.html

Here he writes about the society that it really existed:

The medium Maria Orsic was leader of the 'Vrilerinnen', the beautiful young ladies of the Vril Gesellschaft. Characteristically they all wore their hair in long horsetails, contrary to the popular short bobbed fashion of their day, claiming their long hair acted as cosmic antennas that helped facilitate their contact with beings from other worlds.

According to the legend of the German Vril society, a fateful meeting was held in 1919 at an old hunting lodge near Berchtesgaden, where Maria Orsic presented to a small group assembled from the Thule, Vril and Black Sun Societies, telepathic messages she claimed to have received from an extraterrestrial civilization existing in the distant Aldebaran solar system, sixty-eight light years away, in the Constellation of Taurus. One set of Maria's channeled transmissions was found to be in a secret German Templar script unknown to her.


Researcher Wendelle Stevens tells us that, rather than a militant gesture of aid to aggressive Nazis, the Aldebarans perceived an economic disparity in Earth cultures that fueled perpetual wars and conflict.

To alleviate this disparity the Aldebarans reasoned that by offering 'free-energy' technologies, used to create affordable mass transportation devices, a new innovative generation of industries, promoting prosperity and greater peaceful interaction between nations might result; thus diminishing violent wars.

Clearly such a plan resonated with members of both the Thule and Vril Societies and their dream for a clean and free technology based on this 'alternative science' harnessing Vril energy.

Here is a short summary of messages the Vril medium had received over the years and which formed the basis for all further actions by the Vril-Gesellschaft, compiled by author Jan van Helsing. This material is not science fiction, but represents truly what was going on in the Inner Core of Thule and Vril. It should be emphasized to the reader that even if you don’t believe a word of this, it’s irrelevant. They believed it and they built at least two very complicated secret societies around it - and these societies became quite powerful and influential:


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... ytton.html

The Vril society did not exist:

Vril, the Power of the Coming Race is an 1871 novel by Edward Bulwer-Lytton, originally printed as The Coming Race. Among its readers have been those who have believed that its account of a superior subterranean master race and the energy-form called "Vril" is accurate, to the extent that some theosophists, notably Helena Blavatsky, William Scott-Elliot, and Rudolf Steiner, accepted the book as being (at least in part) based on occult truth.[1] A popular book, The Morning of the Magicians (1960) suggested that a secret Vril Society existed in pre-Nazi Berlin. However, there is no historical evidence for the existence of such a society.


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vril_Society

More info:

Willy Ley[edit]

Willy Ley (right) in a discussion with Heinz Haber and Wernher v. Braun, 1954

Willy Ley was a German rocket engineer who had emigrated to the United States in 1937. In 1947, he published an article entitled "Pseudoscience in Naziland" in the science fiction magazine Astounding Science Fiction.[12] He wrote that the high popularity of irrational convictions in Germany at that time explained how National Socialism could have fallen on such fertile ground. Among various pseudo-scientific groups he mentions one that looked for the Vril: "The next group was literally founded upon a novel. That group which I think called itself Wahrheitsgesellschaft—Society for Truth—and which was more or less localised in Berlin, devoted its spare time looking for Vril."
Jacques Bergier and Louis Pauwels[edit]

The existence of a Vril-Society was alleged in 1960 by Jacques Bergier and Louis Pauwels.[13] In their book The Morning of the Magicians, they claimed that the Vril-Society was a secret community of occultists in pre-Nazi Berlin that was a sort of inner circle of the Thule Society. They also thought that it was in close contact with the English group known as the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. The Vril information takes up about a tenth of the volume, the remainder of which details other esoteric speculations, but the authors fail to clearly explain whether this section is fact or fiction. Historians have shown that there has been no actual historical foundation for the claims of Pauwels and Bergier, and that the article of Willy Ley has only been a vague inspiration for their own ideas. Nevertheless, Pauwels and Bergier have influenced a whole new literary genre dealing with the alleged occult influences on National Socialism which have often been related to the fictional Vril Society.[14]

In his book Monsieur Gurdjieff, Louis Pauwels[15] claimed that a Vril Society had been founded by General Karl Haushofer, a student of Russian magician and metaphysician Georges Gurdjieff.
Publications on the Vril Society in German[edit]

The book of Jacques Bergier and Louis Pauwels was published in German with the title: Aufbruch ins dritte Jahrtausend: von der Zukunft der phantastischen Vernunft (literally Departure into the Third Millennium: The Future of the Fantastic Reason) in 1969.

In his book Black Sun, Professor Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke refers to the research of the German author Peter Bahn. Bahn writes in his 1996 essay, "Das Geheimnis der Vril-Energie" ("The Secret of Vril Energy"),[16] of his discovery of an obscure esoteric group calling itself the "Reichsarbeitsgemeinschaft", which revealed itself in a rare 1930 publication Vril. Die Kosmische Urkraft (Vril, the cosmic elementary power) written by a member of this Berlin-based group, under the pseudonym "Johannes Täufer" (German: "John [the] Baptist"). Published by the influential astrological publisher, Otto Wilhelm Barth (whom Bahn believes was "Täufer"), the 60-page pamphlet says little of the group other than that it was founded in 1925 to study the uses of Vril energy.[17] The German historian Julian Strube has argued that the historical existence of the "Reichsarbeitsgemeinschaft" can be regarded as irrelevant to the post-war invention of the Vril Society, as Pauwels and Bergier have developed their ideas without any knowledge of that actual association.[18] Strube has also shown that the Vril force has been irrelevant to the other members of the "Reichsarbeitsgemeinschaft," who were supporters of the theories of the Austrian inventor Karl Schappeller (1875–1947).[19]
Esoteric neo-Nazism[edit]

After World War II, a group referred to by Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke as the Vienna Circle has elaborated an esoteric neo-Nazism that contributed to the circulation of the Vril topos in a new context.[20] In their writings, the Vril has been associated with Nazi UFOs and the Black Sun concept. As Julian Strube has shown, a younger generation related to the Tempelhofgesellschaft has continued the work of the Vienna Circle, and exerts a continuous influence on the most common notions of Vril. Those notions are not only popular in neo-Nazi circles, but also in movies or computer games, such as Iron Sky or Wolfenstein.[21]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vril_Society#Vril_society

2. Problem: The site Atlantean Gardens gives me quite a skeptical feeling about it. They have strange articles here like claiming Edgar Cayce was right and that Atlantis existed wow:

ATLANTEAN GARDENS

Monday, April 28, 2014
DNA Research Supports Cayce's Atlantean History


In 1997, a fifth mtDNA haplogroup was identified in Native Americans. This group, called "X," is present in three percent of living Native Americans, Haplogroup X was not then found in Asia, but was found only in Europe and the Middle East, primarily in parts of Spain, Bulgaria, Finland, Italy, and Israel.

Archaeologists and geneticists are certain that the presence of "X" in America is not the result of historic intermarriages. It is of ancient origin. In addition, the "X" type has now been found in the ancient remains of the Basque.

Among Native American tribes, the X haplogroup has been found in small numbers in the Yakima, Sioux, and Navaho tribes. It has been found to a larger degree in the Ojibway, Oneota, and Nuu-Chah-Nulth tribes. The X haplogroup has also been discovered in ancient remains in Illinois near Ohio and a few other areas near the Great Lakes. It has not (so far) been found In South or Central American tribes including the (modern) Maya.

The X haplogroup appears to have entered America in limited numbers perhaps as long ago as 34,000 B.C. Around 12,000 B.C. to 10,000 B.C. it appeared in much greater numbers.

It is important to note that not all Native American tribes have been categorized by mtDNA analysis and that relatively few ancient remains have been tested.

The Americas were settled early and many different racial groups came. Several different waves of migration probably occurred. The Initial wave seems to have occurred around 35,000 BC, around the same time that Cro magnon types show up in Western Europe.

The X type in ancient America appears to be linked to the Iroquois. This tribe, of course, was, according to Cayce, partly the remnant of Atlantean survivors from its final destruction in 10,000 B.C.


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... ntean.html

Also here:

The finding of the X group In the north Gobi-dwelling Altasians is hailed as proof that all American migrations came from Siberia via the Bering Straits, yet it seems unlikely.

With the X type being present in the Middle East, Europe, the ancient Basques, and America, a migration from the Gobi to all of these areas is doubtful.

The B haplogroup, found only in aboriginal groups in Southeast Asia, China, Japan, Melanesia, and Polynesia, may represent the people of Mu. Both Chinese and Japanese archaeologists take the idea of Mu seriously, and the B haplogroup findings closely match the story Cayce told about the continent. Most of the people of Mu who escaped the destruction in 50,000 B.C. escaped to China, India, and Japan.

Some time later, descendants of these peoples could have traveled to America. While Cayce said that some people from Mu entered the Americas, he did not indicate the time period when the majority of them came. We only know that it was after 50,000 B.C. and prior to 28,000 B.C.

Cayce Indicated that the largest migration from Atlantis occurred just before 10,000 BC, many of these Atlantean survivors went to the Northeastern coastal areas of America and Canada becoming the Iroquois. The Atlanteans migrating to the Americas merged with the people already present in America by that time.

The Atlanteans became leaders of the tribes and had serious disputes among themselves that were reflected in ongoing violent conflict. This is confirmed by the Iroquois' ancient history that tells of constant battles resulting in distant displacements of entire tribes to ensure their survival.

Perhaps the most astonishing confirmation of Cayce's story of ancient America is the presence of haplogroup X. What is known is that the X haplogroup first showed up in America perhaps 34,000 years ago, but its main entry occurred in 10,000 B.C. These dates match Cayce's timeframe for Atlantean migrations as well as the occurrence of X in the specific tribes predicted by his statements.

The X group also appears to have shown up in ancient Iberia and in the Basques about the same time as well as in the Gobi. These dates match Cayce's story of the final two destructions of Atlantis and the resulting migrations.


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... ntean.html

Edgar Cayce:

Controversy[edit]

Cayce advocated some controversial and eccentric ideas from his trance readings. In many trance sessions, he reinterpreted the history of life on Earth. One of Cayce's controversial claims was that of polygenism. According to Cayce, five human races (white, black, red, brown and yellow) had been created separately but simultaneously on different parts of the Earth. Cayce also accepted the existence of aliens and Atlantis and claimed that "the red race developed in Atlantis and its development was rapid". Another claim by Cayce was that "soul-entities" on Earth intermingled with animals to produce "things," giants that were as much as twelve feet tall.[28][29]

Olav Hammer wrote that many of Cayce's readings discussed race and skin color and that the explanation for this is that Cayce was not a racist but was influenced by the occult ideas of Madame Blavatsky.[30] Robert Todd Carroll, in his book The Skeptic's Dictionary wrote, "Cayce is one of the main people responsible for some of the sillier notions about Atlantis." Carroll mentioned some of Cayce's notions, which included his belief in a giant solar crystal, activated by the sun was used to power energy on Atlantis and his prediction that in 1958 the United States would rediscover a death ray that had been used on Atlantis.[31]

Cayce said the destruction of Atlantis was the result of the central power crystal being tuned too high. It was too unstable to safely power the remote crafts under the sea, on the land and in the air. The strong vibrations of the crystal resonated the earth in a way that eventually caused earthquakes and this was hidden from the population. Cayce said many of the people that came to him for life readings were actually in Atlantis at the time of the destruction, had contributed to the destruction and have reincarnated at this time to try to right the wrongs and not allow a similar event to occur. Cayce foresaw a future where man's present technological achievements could eventually lead the world to a similar fate. Promoters of Cayce's warnings often point out that we are now in the early stages of the diamond age where solar cells can capture the sun's rays, power silicon crystals that resonate microwave frequencies that are amplified by Tesla's transformers and are then broadcast via antennas to recharge devices, power light aircraft, remotely control drones and even modify the weather.[citation needed]

Although Cayce seemed to have acquired the ability to correctly diagnose an illness in the individual,[citation needed] he was often incorrect in his predictions of a distant future. He stressed that the future is determined by man's free will and our collective actions shape the destiny of mankind for better or for worse.
Criticism[edit]

Skeptics say that the evidence for Cayce's powers comes from contemporaneous newspaper articles, affidavits, anecdotes, testimonials, and books. Martin Gardner, for example, wrote that while Cayce's trances did happen, most of the information from his trances was derived from books that Cayce had been reading by authors such as Carl Jung, Ouspensky, and Blavatsky. Gardner's hypothesis was that the trance readings of Cayce contain "little bits of information gleaned from here and there in the occult literature, spiced with occasional novelties from Cayce's unconscious".[32]

Skeptics are also critical of Cayce's support for various forms of alternative medicine, which they regard as quackery.[33] Michael Shermer writes in Why People Believe Weird Things, "Uneducated beyond the ninth grade, Cayce acquired his broad knowledge through voracious reading and from this he wove elaborate tales."[34] Shermer wrote that, "Cayce was fantasy-prone from his youth, often talking with angels and receiving visions of his dead grandfather." Shermer further cites James Randi as saying "Cayce was fond of expressions like 'I feel that' and 'perhaps'—qualifying words used to avoid positive declarations."

Biblical Christians are critical[35] of Cayce's views on issues such as reincarnation,[36] oneness[37] and the Akashic records.[38]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgar_Cayc ... _criticism

More pro-mythical Atlantis take:

http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... frica.html

Or here:

The majority of researchers who dedicate their time to the mystery of Atlantis come to conclude that the kings and masters of Atlantis were the later gods of antiquity in Egypt, Greece, America and northern Europe. This conclusion is based on the assertion that the primeval tribes were so filled with amazement at the abilities of the Atlantean refugees that they regarded and accepted them as divinity.


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.sk/201 ... antis.html

Now lets look onto the article itself:

3. Problem: The historian here in the article is also quite controversial:

Australian historian Greg Jefferys explains that, "The whole ‘Out of Africa’ myth has its roots in the mainstream academic campaign in the 1990′s to remove the concept of Race. When I did my degree they all spent a lot of time on the ‘Out of Africa’ thing but it’s been completely disproved by genetics. Mainstream still hold on to it."


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.com.au ... unked.html

Examples of Greg Jefferys controversial claims:

He published in New Dawn magazine a nice woo magazine:

The Captain Cook Conspiracy
March 1, 2009 By davidjones
By GREG JEFFERYS


Historians and archaeologists consistently ignore solid evidence that Captain James Cook was not the first European to discover Australia while government agencies regularly prohibit access to shipwreck sites which would uncover proof for this assertion.

Why is the true history of Australia being covered up? Why does history treat Captain Cook so kindly, despite the fact that in his later years he was an extraordinarily irritable man who, over the most trivial matters, did not hesitate to flog crew members or burn down entire native villages?

And even though all of the expeditions he led ended in partial or complete failure, Cook is generally, almost universally, lauded as the greatest of navigators and his expeditions seen as milestones in navigation history – and on top of all that it is claimed Cook discovered Australia.


Taken from: http://www.newdawnmagazine.com/articles ... conspiracy

He is also into Crop Circles and they are no hoax people:

Images of U.K. crop circles from 1945 and earlier are evidence that these formations are not made by hoaxers, says an Australian historian.

Greg Jefferys, a PhD student at the University of Tasmania in Hobart, found numerous old crop circles using Google Earth’s new historical imagery from 1945 to examine the English countryside.

“This discovery proves that claims by various artists to be the sole creators of crop circles are themselves a hoax,” Jefferys told The Birmingham Mail. “It just goes to show that the circles remain unexplained.”

“I hope this discovery will stimulate renewed interest in crop circles by serious scientific researchers who have been fooled by the hoax claims.”

Jefferys was inspired to begin this work after reading an article in the journal Nature from 1800 that implied crop circles have been happening since the 18th century.

He believes, like many others, that high-frequency electromagnetic radiation is responsible for the formation of these strange shapes.

“What is not clear is what generates that energy and organises it into circular patterns,” Jefferys told the paper. “This is one of the questions I hope to answer, at least partially.”


Taken from: http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/4499-hi ... -involved/

Skeptical look on his crop circles: http://cropcirclewisdom.com/1/post/2013 ... -born.html

4. Problem: The person who he is quoting and who is working on this quite long. I mean Anatole A. Klyosov:

A very recent paper on Y-chromosomes published in 2012, (Re-Examing the “Out of Africa” Theory and the Origin of Europeoids (Caucasians) in the Light of DNA Genealogy written by Anatole A. Klyosov and Igor L. Rozhanski) only confirms the denial of any African ancestry in non-Africans, and strongly supports the existence of a “common ancestor” who “would not necessarily be in Africa. In fact, it was never proven that he lived in Africa.”


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.com.au ... unked.html

Anatole A. Klyosov is controversial:

Klyosov has been prominent in the Russian mass media concerning his controversial theories of the origin of the Slavic peoples and the Arkaim historic site. Klyosov has offered a theory of haplogroup R1a as the Proto Indo-Europeans and the legendary Aryans.[4][5] He calculated the MRCA of Slavs, Serbs, Russian, Mongolians, Filipinos among other nations and tribes[6][7][8][9] [10][11][12] and the field of DNA genealogy and the study of history of species through DNA "Molecular History". Klyosov have 32 research studies in Pub Med the medical research hub of NIH [1] and hundreds of research papers in Google Scholar and 79 research studies in the doi system [2]. He is Fellow, the World Academy of Art and Science [13] (since 1989), and Foreign Member, the National Academy of Sciences, Georgia [14] (since 2014).

Through Lulu.com he self-publishes the "The Proceedings of the Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy" [15][16] and the "Proceedings of the Academy of DNA Genealogy Boston-Moscow-Tsukuba".[17] Lately, he has presented data against an African origin of modern non-Africans.[18][19]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatole_Klyosov

5. Problem: This also makes me skeptical and the author suggests that there are other strange creatures that can be even aliens etc..:

Recent genetic studies are touting shocking headlines about how ancient humans 'rampantly interbred' and indulged in inter-species interracial sex with multiple mystery sub-races in a "Lord Of The Rings"-style world of different creatures, including mystery DNA - neither human nor Neanderthal, not yet identified.


Taken from: http://atlanteangardens.blogspot.com.au ... unked.html

6. Problem: The out of Africa was only the theory of time being. It can change but it does not disprove evolution at all(just a note for those who believe that when something like this happens that evolution if baloney) but according to the wikipedia page it has a lot of evidence to back it up:

In paleoanthropology, the recent African origin of modern humans, or the "Out of Africa" theory, is the most widely accepted model of the geographic origin and early migration of anatomically modern humans. This model has incorporated the 2010 discovery of genetic evidence for some archaic human admixture with modern Homo sapiens.[1] The theory is called the "(Recent) Out-of-Africa" model in the popular press, and academically the "recent single-origin hypothesis" (RSOH), "Replacement Hypothesis", and "Recent African Origin" (RAO) model. The concept was speculative until the 1980s, when it was corroborated by a study of present-day mitochondrial DNA, combined with evidence based on physical anthropology of archaic specimens.

Genetic studies and fossil evidence show that archaic Homo sapiens evolved to anatomically modern humans solely in Africa, between 200,000 and 60,000 years ago,[2] that members of one branch of Homo sapiens left Africa by between 125,000 and 60,000 years ago, and that over time these humans replaced earlier human populations such as Neanderthals and Homo erectus.[3] The date of the earliest successful "out of Africa" migration (earliest migrants with living descendants) has generally been placed at 60,000 years ago as suggested by genetics, although migration out of the continent may have taken place as early as 125,000 years ago according to Arabian archaeology finds of tools in the region.[4] A 2013 paper reported that a previously unknown lineage had been found, which pushed the estimated date for the most recent common ancestor (Y-MRCA) back to 338,000 years ago.[5]

The recent single origin of modern humans in East Africa is the predominant position held within the scientific community.[6][7][8][9][10] There are differing theories on whether there was a single exodus or several. A multiple dispersal model involves the Southern Dispersal theory,[11] which has gained support in recent years from genetic, linguistic and archaeological evidence. A growing number of researchers also suspect that "long-neglected North Africa" was the original home of the modern humans who first trekked out of the continent.[12][13][14]

The major competing hypothesis is the multiregional origin of modern humans, which envisions a wave of Homo sapiens migrating earlier from Africa and interbreeding with local Homo erectus populations in multiple regions of the globe. Most multiregionalists still view Africa as a major wellspring of human genetic diversity, but allow a much greater role for hybridization.[15][16]

Genetic testing in the last decade has revealed that several now extinct archaic human species may have interbred with modern humans. These species have been claimed to have left their genetic imprint in different regions across the world: Neanderthals in all humans except Sub-Saharan Africans, Denisova hominin in Australasia (for example, Melanesians, Aboriginal Australians and some Negritos) and there could also have been interbreeding between Sub-Saharan Africans and an as-yet-unknown hominin (possibly remnants of the ancient species Homo heidelbergensis). However, the rate of interbreeding was found to be relatively low (1-10%) and other studies have suggested that the presence of Neanderthal or other archaic human genetic markers in modern humans can be attributed to shared ancestral traits originating from a common ancestor 500,000 to 800,000 years ago.[17][18][19][20][21]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_Afr ... ern_humans

Conclusion: What to tell people who worked on this are quite controversial. This does not mean when someone is controversial that he is not right but I have my doubts about these people. The Africa origin has evidence to back this up. Also the source which printed this science article is quite woo like so I am extremely skeptical of this and for me this is not debunking of a the African Origin theory. The only thing which the article brought was bringing counter evidence if the experiment is done good. That is all which they bought. So to call it DEBUNKED is a faaar cry and the author makes strange conclusions to support his views like it was in the Cayce case or others ones where he claims that Atlantis is the cause.

Does someone has some thoughts about this??
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clarsct
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Re: Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby clarsct » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:41 am

I think you're on the right track. It sounds like some sort of oblique racism is going on, as well. As though the implication is that the white folks are Atlanteans, and the black folks are Africans....who the hell knows about the oriental guys... Probably Shangri-La...

The evidence overwhelmingly points to Africa, somewhere near Kenya for our distant ancestors, and South Africa for our species, in general. The real dispute right now is when and how migrations happened, because we keep finding hominid remains earlier in wider regions than we anticipated. This does not mean that the Africa idea is wrong, it simply means that we or our ancestors had quite a bit more wanderlust than we gave them credit for.

The genetics to NOT show any evidence for 'multiple races' of H. Sapiens, unless you count some Neanderthal crossbreeding. There was a pygmy group out in the Pacific Islands, but, apparently, they were not selected for.

IIRC, from a genetics class, there is more genetic difference between a white cat and a black cat than between a white woman and a black man. Yet, we call them all cats.
(Cite needed, couldn't dredge up anything on Google.)
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Shen1986
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Re: Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby Shen1986 » Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:50 am

I have the paper. Posted this also on the JREF:

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=281061

The paper can be found here a moderator zooterkin has found it:

http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInfor ... 9ds0kf-hQB

The paper gives me little confidence in it. Even the reference page they almost only refer to their literature little of foreign ones and it is 6-7 pages long:

Cruciani, F., Trombetta, B., Sellitto, D., Massaia, A., Destro-Bisol, G., Watson, E., et al. (2010). Human Y chromosome haplogroup R-V88: A paternal genetic record of early mid Holocene trans-Saharan con- nections and the spread of Chadic languages. European Journal of Human Genetics, 18, 800-807.
Cruciani, F., Trombetta, B., Massaia, A., Destro-Bisol, G., Sellitto, D., & Scozzari, R. (2011). A revised root for the human Y chromosomal phylogenetic tree: The origin of patrilineal diversity in Africa. The American Journal of Human Genetics, 88, 1-5. doi:10.1016/j.ajhg.2011.05.002
Klyosov, A. A. (2009a). DNA Genealogy, mutation rates, and some Copyright © 2012 SciRes. 85
A. A. KLYOSOV, I. L. ROZHANSKII
86 Copyright © 2012 SciRes.
historical evidences written in Y-chromosome. I. Basic principles and the method. Journal of Genetic Genealogy, 5, 186-216.
Klyosov, A. A. (2009b). DNA Genealogy, mutation rates, and some historical evidences written in Y-chromosome. II. Walking the map. Journal of Genetic Genealogy, 5, 217-256.
Klyosov, A. A. (2011a). The slowest 22 marker haplotype panel (out of the 67 marker panel) and their mutation rate constants employed for calculations timespans to the most ancient common ancestors. Pro- ceedings of the Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy, 4, 1240-1257.
Klyosov, A. A. (2011b). DNA genealogy of major haplogroups of Y chromosome (Part 1). Proceedings of the Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy, 4, 1258-1283.
Klyosov, A. A. (2012). Ancient history of the Arbins, bearers of hap- logroup R1b, from Central Asia to Europe, 16,000 to 1,500 years before present. Advances in Anthropology, in press.
Rozhanskii, I. (2010). Evaluation оf the сonvergence оf sets in STR phylogeny and analysis оf the haplogroup R1a1 tree. Proceedings of the Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy, 3, 1316-1324.
Rozhanskii, I. L., & Klyosov, A. A. (2011). Mutation rate constants in DNA genealogy (Y chromosome). Advances in Anthropology, 1, 26- 34. doi:10.4236/aa.2011.12005
Simms, T. M., Martinez, E., Herrera, K. J., Wright, M. R., Perez, O. A., Hernandez, M. et al. (2011). Paternal lineages signal distinct genetic contributions from British Loyalists and continental Africans among different Bahamian islands. American Journal of Physical Anthro-pology, 146, 594-608. doi:10.1002/ajpa.21616


Taken from: http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInfor ... 9ds0kf-hQB
Pages: 6-7
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Re: Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:01 am

Enough with the walls of text. Bye.
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Re: Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby Shen1986 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:07 am

Members of the JREF forum pointed out good things why to be skeptical. His research is published in a controversial journal:

^ Klyosov, Anatole A. (2012). "Re-Examining the "Out of Africa" Theory and the Origin of Europeoids (Caucasoids) in Light of DNA Genealogy". Advances in Anthropology 02 (02): 80–86. doi:10.4236/aa.2012.22009.
Jump up ^ Klyosov, Anatole A. (2014). "Reconsideration of the "Out of Africa" Concept as Not Having Enough Proof". Advances in Anthropology 04 (01): 18–37. doi:10.4236/
aa.2014.41004.


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatole_Klyosov

Here is his work: http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInfor ... 9decfldXrc

Scientific Research Publishing:

Its website states it was founded in 2007 and has other offices in California, Shanghai, and Hong Kong. The company has been accused of being a predatory open access publisher, and of abusing bulk email.[2]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advances_in_Anthropology

Controversies[edit]

Scientific Research Publishing has been included in a list of questionable open access publishers,[4][5] according to Jeffrey Beall's criteria.[6] Beall states that "This publisher exists for two reasons. First, it exists to exploit the author-pays Open Access model to generate revenue, and second, it serves as an easy place for foreign (chiefly Chinese) authors to publish overseas and increase their academic status." He acknowledges that its fees are relatively low, describing this as "a strategy that increases article submissions," and that "it has attracted some quality article submissions. Nevertheless, it is really a vanity press."[2]


The company generated controversy in 2010 when it was found that its journals duplicated papers which had already been published elsewhere, without notification of or permission from the original author.[7] Several of these publications have subsequently been retracted.[8] Some of the journals had listed academics on their editorial boards without their permission or even knowledge, sometimes in fields very different from their own.[9] In 2012, one of its journals, Advances in Pure Mathematics, accepted a paper written by a random text generator. However, the paper was not published, due to its author's unwillingness to pay the publication fee.[10] The company has also been noted for the many unsolicited bulk emails it sends to academics about its journals.[2][9]


Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advances_in_Anthropology
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Re: Out of Africa Theory Officially Debunked?

Postby Shen1986 » Fri Aug 01, 2014 5:46 am

This also leaves me skeptical:

Based on palaeoarchaeological evidence, the region, where anatomically modern humans have likely originated, is com- prised of a vast territory from Central Europe in the west to the Russian Plain in the east to Levant in the south. Each of these regions is renowned for discoveries of the oldest skeletal re- mains of modern humans dating back to 42,000 - 44,000 ybp. To date, none of these sub-regions has clear and unequivocal advances in this regard.


Taken from: http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInfor ... 9ds0kf-hQB
Page: 6

When I googled for oldest skeletal re- mains of modern humans Asia came out and Africa not what he claims:

Newfound pieces of human skull from "the Cave of the Monkeys" in Laos are the earliest skeletal evidence yet that humans once had an ancient, rapid migration to Asia.

Anatomically modern humans first arose about 200,000 years ago in Africa. When and how our lineage then dispersed out of Africa has long proven controversial.

Archaeological evidence and genetic data suggest that modern humans rapidly migrated out of Africa and into Southeast Asia by at least 60,000 years ago. However, complicating this notion is the notable absence of fossil evidence for modern human occupation in mainland Southeast Asia, likely because those bones do not survive well in the warm, tropical region.




Now a partial skull from Tam Pa Ling, "the Cave of the Monkeys" in northern Laos helps fill in this mysterious gap in the fossil record. [See Photos of "Monkey Cave" Fossils]

"Most surprising is the fact that we found anything at all," researcher Laura Lynn Shackelford, a paleoanthropologist at the University of Illinois, told LiveScience. "Most people didn't think we'd find anything in these caves, or even in the region where we're working in mainland Southeast Asia. But we're stubborn, gone where no one's really looked before, or at least in almost a century."

Rough terrain, persistent scientists

The fossils were discovered in 2009 in the limestone cave, which is located at the top of the Pa Hang Mountain 3,840 feet (1,170 meters) above sea level.

"The cave is surrounded by lots of papaya and banana trees, so a troop of monkeys likes to come and forage there, therefore its name," Shackelford said.


Taken from: http://www.livescience.com/22529-oldest ... -asia.html
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