The People Who Can't Wear Watches

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:33 am

did you not read the link? http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm

ATPase is non functional, allowing an excess of sodium ions to be in the nerve cell . more sodium ions = higher voltage. it's called diabetic neuropathy and perhaps this goes undiagnosed in these people as it allows a higher concentration of sodium to exist in the nerves, resulting in an increased voltage.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:43 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:did you not read the link? http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm

ATPase is non functional, allowing an excess of sodium ions to be in the nerve cell . more sodium ions = higher voltage. it's called diabetic neuropathy and perhaps this goes undiagnosed in these people.


MarkgaB5? What is the maximum "Action Potential" for a "Nerve spike" through either voltage-gated sodium channels or voltage-gated calcium channels, in a human nerve cell, according to your calculations?

What is the maximum duration of either of these actions?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:44 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:[Do I have permission to kill MarkgaB5 aka Cobalt6?


It would be a simple thing. I think that a quick flick of a piezo-electric cigarette lighter in Sydney would do the job as long as you direct your thoughts towards mainland USA.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:46 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
MarkgaB5 wrote:did you not read the link? http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm

ATPase is non functional, allowing an excess of sodium ions to be in the nerve cell . more sodium ions = higher voltage. it's called diabetic neuropathy and perhaps this goes undiagnosed in these people.


MarkgaB5? What is the maximum "Action Potential" for a "Nerve spike" through either voltage-gated sodium channels or voltage-gated calcium channels, in a human nerve cell, according to your calculations?

What is the maximum duration of either of these actions?


depends if the sodium/potassium gates are working properly. if theyre not, its possible for them to allow more ions inside than is normal (read the link i gave you) and thatll result in more voltage .

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:49 am

1 microvolt? 2? 10 microvolts? What?

Do you know, Mark?

Do you know the that generated voltage of that cigarette lighter Matthew is now looking for is around 14000 volts?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:52 am

80+ millivolts is NORMAL but with diabetic neuropathy this would of course be much larger.
ill give the link again as youre so reluctant to read it

http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:27 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:80+ millivolts is NORMAL but with diabetic neuropathy this would of course be much larger.
ill give the link again as youre so reluctant to read it

http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm


The words "millivolt" and "80+" do not appear in the article you linked concerning Peripheral neuropathy. You didn't read it. Peripheral neuropathy causes nerve damage, not exploding watches.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:28 am

80 millivolts? Wow!!!

Your electrical knowledge can come into its own now, Mark. Multiply that 80mV by the magnitude of electrical current typically found in a human nerve cell, then factor in the duration of the current (because synapses don't stay open for very long) and you have an effective power of what, Mark?

Is it enough to induce a magnetic field capable of stopping a watch? Could that magnetic field induce a current capable of significantly affecting a street lighting circuit?

Come back when you've done the maths.

EDIT: Hey, Mark - look at the the timings! Matthew actually went and read what you actually "quoted". It's more than you did, isn't it?
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:29 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
MarkgaB5 wrote:80+ millivolts is NORMAL but with diabetic neuropathy this would of course be much larger.
ill give the link again as youre so reluctant to read it

http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm


The words "millivolt" and "80+" do not appear in the article you linked concerning Peripheral neuropathy. You didn't read it. Peripheral neuropathy causes nerve damage, not exploding watches.


80 millivolts is the max voltage cited when the channels are working NORMALLY. however as the article i linked mentions things can go wrong , and a much higher conc. of ions is allowed to exist in the cell.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:32 am

So what's the max voltage when the channels are working ABNORMALLY?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:33 am

thats unknown , possibly any amount possible depending on how badly the channels are malfunctioning.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:38 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:ive researched how nerves work
MarkgaB5 wrote:thats unknown , possibly any amount possible depending on how badly the channels are malfunctioning.
No it's not MarkgaB5. You will be able to easily workout the maximum potential ionization voltage as there is a maximum amount of sodium that a nerve cell can absorb. You know what that is from your research. What is it? :D

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:39 am

no, the ions are pumped using active transport meaning its against a gradient , so any amount of sodium ions would be allowed in if its not working correctly .

once again you failed to read the article so once again ill give you the link again! http://www.lsuhsc.edu/news/LSUHSC%20RES ... OPATHY.htm

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:42 am

Nothing in that link supports what you're saying - not even if you follow the links in the link. Now stop prevaricating and answer some questions. It's YOUR theory - YOU should know the answers.

EDIT: Oh - hold on. You didn't just make this stuff up in your head, did you?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:45 am

Poodle wrote:Nothing in that link supports what you're saying - not even if you follow the links in the link. Now stop prevaricating and answer some questions. It's YOUR theory - YOU should know the answers.

EDIT: Oh - hold on. You didn't just make this stuff up in your head, did you?


okay, since youre so BLIND ill read it to you! ;)

''In these patients, an enzyme called sodium potassium ATPase, know as the sodium pump because it pumps excess sodium ions out of the cell, does not work. When inflammation occurs, it triggers an increase in the number and sensitivity of sodium channels in the nerve cell membrane causing an influx of sodium with no way to get rid of it. ''

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:47 am

Right.

And ...

"... so any amount of sodium ions would be allowed in if its not working correctly . "

... where did that come from?

It came off the top of your head, didn't it, Mark?
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:49 am

Poodle wrote:Right.

And?


let me make this a little easier for you since i understand youre hard of english.

'In these patients, an enzyme called sodium potassium ATPase, know as the sodium pump because it pumps excess sodium ions out of the cell, does not work. - this means that sodium ions, that give the cell charge, build up in the cell

When inflammation occurs, it triggers an increase in the number and sensitivity of sodium channels in the nerve cell membrane causing an influx of sodium with no way to get rid of it. ''

sodium ions build up , resulting in an increase of charge . this would then cause an increase in magnetic field strength and voltage .

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:49 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:no, the ions are pumped using active transport meaning its against a gradient , so any amount of sodium ions would be allowed in if its not working correctly .
I see. So sodium will never reach saturation? I could fit 10 tons into a single nerve cell? Did you learn this in biology?

Ionic Selectivity, Saturation, and Block in Sodium Channels / A Four-Barrier Model
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:50 am

But that doesn't say what you said, Mark, now does it?

Hard of English?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:51 am

okay, so what is the saturation point? because sodium / potassium channels etc pump sodium / other ions into the cell through ACTIVE TRANSPORT which means it's AGAINST a gradient so any concentration of ions may be allowed in .

NO WHERE does the article say that theres a limit to how many ions may enter the cell if the sodium/potassium channels were to remain open or ATPase were to stop functioning allowing a build up of ions
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:53 am

I went to the supermarket today and asked for a bag of potatoes. When I got one, I asked them to put another bag of potatoes into the one I'd already got. They told me to {!#%@} off.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:59 am

MarkgaB5 wrote: ive researched how nerves work
MarkgaB5 wrote: okay, so what is the saturation point?
You tell us and we will check your work.

You are a troll suffering some form of mania. You will keep asking us to look things up for you for ever.

However, as you claimed you have researched how nerves work then you can present your research or (more likely) fabricate a quote, as you have done in the past numerous times. I will check your "research".

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:59 am

;;Ionic Selectivity, Saturation, and Block in Sodium Channels / A Four-Barrier Model;;

NO WHERE does it say that when the conc. reaches a certain point inside nerve cells can ions not enter, assuming that the channels are faulty and cant sense voltage . (which happens in diabetic neuropathy with ATPase)

You pulled the article out of your @$$. it says nothing about concentration limitation.
what drugs you on buddy?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:02 am

With respect, Your Honour, I refer you to the Bag of Potatoes syndrome presented in evidence at an earlier time.

(Translation: Ever heard of saturation, Mark? Actually, at the power levels you're insisting upon, super-saturation. Hard of chemistry and maths?)

EDIT 2: Sorry Matthew - I wasn't trying to steal your thunder.
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:03 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:NO WHERE does the article say that theres a limit to how many ions may enter the cell if the sodium/potassium channels were to remain open or ATPase were to stop functioning allowing a build up of ions
It does Mark. You didn't read it. Look under "saturation". It's one of the four barriers.

Ionic Selectivity, Saturation, and Block in Sodium Channels / A Four-Barrier Model

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:05 am

oh WOW, you bolded the word saturation!
saturation is only a barrier when the channels are working correctly and can sense voltage. they NORMALLY close when the conc. reaches a certain point.

in diabetic neuropathy this doesnt happen with ATPase.

TRY AGAIN. :lol:

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:06 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:oh WOW, you bolded the word saturation!
That's right. You missed it the first time you read it, remember?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Saturation, you numpty, does not depend upon access. Try dissolving 100 pounds of sugar in a pint of water in an open pan.

EDIT: Oh {!#%@}! Did it again.
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:08 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:in diabetic neuropathy this doesnt happen with ATPase.

TRY AGAIN. :lol:

So Mark? You can place 10 tons of sodium in a single nerve cell? Please explain in depth how you do this?
:D

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:08 am

it is only relevant to ion channels working NORMALLY because when the voltage gets to a certain point the channels close, and others open , so the voltage doesnt exceed +80 mv.. this isnt the case in diabetic neuropathy where ATPase fails to sense voltage and doesnt get rid of excess sodium ions .

placing 10 tons of sodium in a nerve cell isnt possible. it is however possible to get a very large concentration of ions inside a malfunctioning cell , as seen in DIABETIC NEUROPATHY.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Major Malfunction » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:11 am

Why do you guys bother? You know he's just a shit-stirrer, and will never admit he's wrong. You should've learnt how trolls operate by now.
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:13 am

Major Malfunction wrote:Why do you guys bother? You know he's just a shit-stirrer, and will never admit he's wrong. You should've learnt how trolls operate by now.


yeah sure, even though i actually present evidence for my claims while these other people just pull sh!t out of their a$$ without even reading what they source. :lol:

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:13 am

Yeah, but my team are languishing at the bottom of the Premier League and I have to take it out on someone. Mark very kindly offered to oblige :D

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:14 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:yeah sure, even though i actually present evidence for my claims while these other people just pull sh!t out of their a$$ without even reading what they source. :lol:


WTF?

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:14 am

MarkgaB5 wrote:ive researched how nerves work
MarkgaB5 wrote:placing 10 tons of sodium in a nerve cell isnt possible
MarkgaB5 wrote:it is however possible to get a very large concentration of ions inside a malfunctioning cell

And what did the linked scientific paper say was the saturation point Mark?
:D

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:16 am

CTRL + F (typed in ''saturation point'')

0 matches.

None. because it isn't mentioned. :D

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Poodle » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:18 am

Therefore there is no saturation point! Brilliant research, Mark.

I believe this is an instance of the "ner ner nee ner nah" rebuttal.
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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:19 am

Matthew Ellard is a bad liar!

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:19 am

Poodle wrote:
MarkgaB5 wrote:yeah sure, even though i actually present evidence for my claims while these other people just pull sh!t out of their a$$ without even reading what they source. :lol:


WTF?

He's got mania. He knows he is being shredded but can't "back off". It has been interesting observing him jump back & forth between the two threads. His posts are now degrading as we force him to respond quickly. Cobalt6 claimed he has dyslexia when this happen to him. (Thank you Scmbldggs) I'm waiting for Mark's excuse.

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Re: The People Who Can't Wear Watches

Postby MarkgaB5 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:21 am

you asked me for the saturation point, yet it isnt mentioned in the paper... taking some good hallucinogens matt? youre seeing things that aint there!


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