Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:41 pm

Daedalus wrote:
Yeah, this has been entertaining, but I think I'm done with it for now.


Bye bye.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:41 pm

Did the Swedish embassy ever reply to your request for legal aid against the nasty Jan?

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:43 pm

Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:44 pm

In case you can't find the reference, it's round about page 75 - roughly where you tell everyone how much your video would be worth if it proves to be a real sea serpent on it.

A slight odour of commercial protectionism is beginning to pervade the atmosphere.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:47 pm

Poodle wrote:Did the Swedish embassy ever reply to your request for legal aid against the nasty Jan?


Nope and we didn't expect them to but Sundberg and his wife stopped posting fraudulent articles about us and Paiva after that.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Gord » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:47 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:
Pyrrho wrote:The upshot of all of this is that it doesn't matter what expert looks at your pictures and declares them to be sea serpents, because there simply isn't enough image data in the images to make any such determination.

We would never send our video to someone who is so biased they would claim there is not enough data in our video to claim the video contains images of a sea serpent before they even view our entire video. Therefore, you can count that "expert" of yours out.

He made that statement about the images you posted from the video, duh. He specifically said "pictures", not "video". And he was correct: There simply is not enough information in the pictures you've provided here for anyone to determine they showed a sea serpent.

People speculating on what you must be hiding if you did have evidence of sea serpents came much later in this thread.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Gord » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:49 pm

Poodle wrote:A slight odour of commercial protectionism is beginning to pervade the atmosphere.

It struck me months ago. I would call it "strench" rather than "odour", however.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Daedalus » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:00 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.


No Shmucky/Bob, that's your life in which the alternative to this is playing with yourself... I'm going to play with people other than you. :lol:
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Cobalt6 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:26 pm

Daedalus wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.


No Shmucky/Bob, that's your life in which the alternative to this is playing with yourself... I'm going to play with people other than you. :lol:


Now it's extremely obvious these guys are trolling, despite being proven previously to be trolls, but now I'm 100% certain of it.

Go get a new shtick guys, this one's worn dry. Get some better insults as well.You act like 12 year old boys.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:52 pm

Cobalt6 wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.


No Shmucky/Bob, that's your life in which the alternative to this is playing with yourself... I'm going to play with people other than you. :lol:


Now it's extremely obvious these guys are trolling, despite being proven previously to be trolls, but now I'm 100% certain of it.

Go get a new shtick guys, this one's worn dry. Get some better insults as well.You act like 12 year old boys.


We have never been previously proven to be trolls because we're not trolls.

We're here defending the truth about our sightings and if you don't like that then you leave.

You guys are just upset that two eyewitnesses who had a definitive sighting of a sea serpent in San Francisco Bay FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY are on this site taking on your nonsense.

BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you.

Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:55 pm

Daedalus wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.


No Shmucky/Bob, that's your life in which the alternative to this is playing with yourself... I'm going to play with people other than you. :lol:


Go play with anyone you want.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Cobalt6 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:06 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:
Cobalt6 wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:
Daedalus wrote:
Anyway... l8r Shmucky/Bob, I'll stop by to post more audio bits of you and the puppet, but beyond that this has gotten dull.


It's fine with with us if you go play with yourself.


No Shmucky/Bob, that's your life in which the alternative to this is playing with yourself... I'm going to play with people other than you. :lol:


Now it's extremely obvious these guys are trolling, despite being proven previously to be trolls, but now I'm 100% certain of it.

Go get a new shtick guys, this one's worn dry. Get some better insults as well.You act like 12 year old boys.


We have never been previously proven to be trolls because we're not trolls.

We're here defending the truth about our sightings and if you don't like that then you leave.

You guys are just upset that two eyewitnesses who had a definitive sighting of a sea serpent in San Francisco Bay FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY are on this site taking on your nonsense.

BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you.

Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!


For the FOURTH time (can I possibly make the text any redder or obvious to you?)

you admitted to me you came here on this thread for entertainment purposes.

Cobalt6 wrote:
If you think you're right why did you come here?

sfseaserpent wrote:
For the same reason a cat plays with a mouse before it eats the mouse.
Cheap entertainment.


That is the hallmark of a troll.
Don't dare forget that you posted that statement because it reveals the reason why you're even participating on this thread, as I asked.

Coupled with your childish insults, refusal to show evidence, and logical fallacies, it's only logical for me to conclude you are both trolling us and get kicks out of this.

I could care less of a report coming from a person who believes pterosaurs still roam the Earth and that movie prop photos are evidence for living pterosaurs, as well as finding Noah's Ark. Those types of people would interpret a blob of dirt on the lens as evidence for a living stegosaurus and then write a report on why their conclusion is correct, even though it is painfully obvious that a black blob on the lens isn't a living stegosaurus and the only reason you and your (discredited) ''expert'' cannot see this is because you're blinded by your own logical fallacies and confirmation bias.

Matt has already shown you how your footage can be replicated. I pity you if you seriously think a single animal can bend itself at such angles (90 - 180 degrees? Yeah, try subject a spinal vertebrae to such an angle and see how it shatters under the load. This overload is accentuated in mammals, as laterial force puts more stress on the spinal vertebrae - which would apply to your hoax sea serpent as it is apparently a reptile, mammal and fish all at once but undulates vertically.)
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Re: Sea Ser[quote="Gord"][quote="Poodpents in San Francisco

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:13 pm

Gord wrote:
Poodle wrote:A slight odour of commercial protectionism is beginning to pervade the atmosphere.

It struck me months ago. I would call it "strench" rather than "odour", however.


Do you mean "stench" not "strench"?
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A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:28 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:... BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you.

Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!


I don't think it even vaguely likely that anyone here is going to give Clifford Paiva an email address. So how does he propose we set this up, boys? Oh - I know. We could set up a thread in the Moderated Discussions section. Oh no - then we couldn't prove it was Paiva.

Has he any practical suggestions, boys?

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:35 pm

Cobalt6 wrote:
Cobalt6 wrote:
If you think you're right why did you come here?

sfseaserpent wrote:
For the same reason a cat plays with a mouse before it eats the mouse.
Cheap entertainment.


That is the hallmark of a troll.
Don't dare forget that you posted that statement because it reveals the reason why you're even participating on this thread, as I asked.

Coupled with your childish insults, refusal to show evidence, and logical fallacies, it's only logical for me to conclude you are both trolling us and get kicks out of this.

I could care less of a report coming from a person who believes pterosaurs still roam the Earth and that movie prop photos are evidence for living pterosaurs, as well as finding Noah's Ark. Those types of people would interpret a blob of dirt on the lens as evidence for a living stegosaurus and then write a report on why their conclusion is correct, even though it is painfully obvious that a black blob on the lens isn't a living stegosaurus and the only reason you and your (discredited) ''expert'' cannot see this is because you're blinded by your own logical fallacies and confirmation bias.


You are so full of BS.

We first came here to inform th members of this site about our video and invite you to provide us with an expert image analyst of your choice so we could send them a copy of our video at no cost to them for them to analyze.

After you guys refused then attacked us with YOUR insults then we kept coming back here to provide this site with new information that proved you guys wrong.

However, since we know we are telling the truth about our sightings, photos and videos it is cheap entertainment to us to watch you guys try to prove your false claims about us and our sightings.



Cobalt6 wrote:Matt has already shown you how your footage can be replicated. I pity you if you seriously think a single animal can bend itself at such angles (90 - 180 degrees? Yeah, try subject a spinal vertebrae to such an angle and see how it shatters under the load. This overload is accentuated in mammals, as laterial force puts more stress on the spinal vertebrae - which would apply to your hoax sea serpent.)


Are you guys familiar with how this animal can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?
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A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:43 pm

Poodle wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:... BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you.

Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!


I don't think it even vaguely likely that anyone here is going to give Clifford Paiva an email address. So how does he propose we set this up, boys? Oh - I know. We could set up a thread in the Moderated Discussions section. Oh no - then we couldn't prove it was Paiva.

Has he any practical suggestions, boys?


You girls can contact Paiva directly using his email address.

However, we think you girls are this.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Cobalt6 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:44 pm

You are so full of BS.

We first came here to inform th members of this site about our video and invite you to provide us with an expert image analyst of your choice so we could send them a copy of our video at no cost to them for them to analyze.

After you guys refused then attacked us with YOUR insults then we kept coming back here to provide this site with new information that proved you guys wrong.

However, since we know we are telling the truth about our sightings, photos and videos it is cheap entertainment to us to watch you guys try to prove your false claims about us and our sightings.


No, you're chickening out because it's been revealed you are both a troll AND a hoaxer.
You came here for ''cheap entertainment'' as you stated.


Are you guys familiar with how this animal can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?


Bad example.

Your hoax sea serpent undulates vertically. Snakes can position their bodies laterially at odd looking angles because their spines are reptilian, and are suited for laterial movement. Humans, for example, are mammals and stuited to vertical undulation (look at any professional swimmer). You cannot have a vertebrate that is suited to both vertical and laterial undulation - for the same reason you cannot bend yourself sideways easily, but you can almost touch your toes. Only invertebrates can undulate both vertically and laterially with free movement (an example being caterpillars).

A sea serpent-like animal, known as a plesiosaur, had a serpentine neck which constituted half of its body length or more. Despite this, it could not lift its neck out of the water, due to its reptilian spinal structure. It could only move side-to-side and move its neck just enough so that its nostrils were out of the water so it could breathe. Sea snakes do this as well. They can only position themselves vertically at a minor angle, because to reptiles moving the spine vertically feels the same as trying to bend yourself laterially.

Notice the strain on your back when you try to bend yourself laterially, and lack of strain when bending over vertically.

Your hoax sea serpent must have a broken back. No wonder he's lunging at everything he sees, they have no ibuprofen tablets in the sea. I'd be ticked off too. It also explains why he's in pieces; poor thing did yoga a little too much.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:58 pm

Cobalt6 wrote:
Are you guys familiar with how this animal can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?


Bad example.

Your hoax sea serpent undulates vertically. Snakes can position their bodies laterially at odd looking angles because their spines are reptilian, and are suited for laterial movement. Humans, for example, are mammals and stuited to vertical undulation (look at any professional swimmer). You cannot have a vertebrate that is suited to both vertical and laterial undulation - for the same reason you cannot bend yourself sideways easily, but you can almost touch your toes.

Notice the strain on your back when you try to bend yourself laterially, and lack of strain when bending over vertically.

Your hoax sea serpent must have a broken back. No wonder he's lunging at everything he sees, they have no ibuprofen tablets in the sea. I'd be ticked off too.


It's a great example.

You girls claimed there was no known animal that could even bend its body only 90 degrees.

It doesn't matter if a rattlesnake bends its body laterally 90-180 degrees.

Its still an animal that's capable of bending its body 90-180 degrees.

QED.
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Cobalt6 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:01 pm

It's a great example.

You girls claimed there was no known animal that could even bend its body only 90 degrees.


What I meant to say was no known animal (meaning vertebrates, which are commonly referred to when mentioning the term as invertebrates are an entirely different leaugue of animal) could even bend its body only 90 degrees with a vertebrae structure that only permitted one dimension of movement (laterial for example). Snakes can only do this with help from the ground, and is limited to their front portion - this is impossible to do without it, meaning they cannot do it freely!

It doesn't matter if a rattlesnake bends its body laterally 90-180 degrees.

Its still an animal that's capable of bending its body 90-180 degrees.

QED.


Laterially, not vertically. Place a rattlesnake in deep water so it can't use the ground for balance. It will not be able to ''stand up'' because of the spinal stress of trying to without assistance from the ground.

Try lying on your side in water and then try and get your head out the water by moving your back laterially. Can't do it can you?

More to the point:

Why the heck would a sea snake need to evolve a -50% less efficient manner of propulsion? They already swim rather slowly. Evolution and natural selection simply doesn't support sea serpents. Sea serpent ''humps'' are a very silly idea in terms of realism and were used for aesthetic purposes in artist's renditions for the same reason dragons have 6 limbs. Realism doesn't count in art.

You are a filthy liar until you prove yourself. Your personal anecdote and what you think you ''know'' means jack****.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:20 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:Are you guys familiar with how this animal can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?


Well yes. An Eastern Diamondback rattlesnake has an absolute maximum length of 8 feet. It's body diameter is a few inches at most and it is, therefore, extremely flexible. There can be no comparison between the flexibilities of animals so different in size. (Clue, boys - I can bend a thin copper wire back on itself with ease. I can persuade a 1/4 inch copper rod to bend maybe to 90 degrees, but it would be showing signs of metal fatigue before long. Trying to do that to a, let's say, 18 inch diameter copper rod would be impossible without greatly increasing the radius of the bend.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:29 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:You girls can contact Paiva directly using his email address.


You must have misread my previous post. No one is likely to supply a man such as Clifford Paiva with an email address on the grounds that he is the type of person who would misuse it (ie his dishonesty is evident all over the net). He's not as dumb as you, and knows that his invitation will not be taken up. He'll then find it easy to convince two dumbasses (that's you, boys) that it somehow means that he's "won". You are the only ones here openly dealing with a fraud.

Get your man onto this forum - in the Moderated Discussions section, where everyone has to behave. It's not too complicated to do, so he should be able to manage it.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Daedalus » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:31 pm

Why would we WANT to contact Paiva? I mean, other than the brief amusement that would ensue when he tried to explain the Pterodactyl bit, it seems kind of pointless.

Now Champagne, the fish food salesman... that could be fun. :lol:
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby busterggi » Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:00 pm

"You girls can contact Paiva directly using his email address."

Seriously, you think calling everyone who disagrees with you a girl is insulting? Are you two still in 2nd grade?

"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"
"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"
"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"

Even saying it three times won't make its magic work.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:05 pm

sfseaserpent wrote:
Poodle wrote:Did the Swedish embassy ever reply to your request for legal aid against the nasty Jan?


Nope and we didn't expect them to but Sundberg and his wife stopped posting fraudulent articles about us and Paiva after that.


You know, boys, on this one I believe you. Whether or not you're telling the truth, I can honestly say that after you've stuck to your story for so long I find it impossible to think that you would have actually admitted to a hoax. So why on Earth, do you think, did Sundberg turn on you?

(No tricks or traps here, boys - I'm genuinely puzzled).

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:44 pm

sfseaserpent wrote: BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you. Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!


Firstly, as his revised 2005 report contains fundamental errors it has been removed as any form of evidence. There is nothing I need to ask him concerning this particular hoax.

Secondly, I am not going to debate Clifford Paiva in private. You two clowns came to this skeptic forum to have a public debate and got shredded. Clifford Paiva is most welcome to defend his honour and BSMRA here, in public. However you know he won't come here as the first questions will be about his use of film props as "evidence" and false claims in his "resume". As this thread is now a "hit" for Clifford Paiva on search engines, he's probably already getting worried. He has you two to thank.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Matthew Ellard » Thu Oct 31, 2013 10:16 pm

sfseaserpent wrote: Are you guys familiar with ( rattlesnake photo below) can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?
Rattle snake.jpg
The rattlesnake weighs 2.3 kilos and has a diameter of 8 centimeters. Your hoax sea monster weighs 5,000 kilos and has a diameter of 66 centimeters (26 inches). Can you show me how you bend a 66cm tube to form the little black dots (individual birds) as seen in the still frame from your video?
Graph paper sea monster.jpg
Birds flying.jpg
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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Thu Oct 31, 2013 10:37 pm

Hmmmm .... a new experience.

I've never actually been inside a pregnant pause before now.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:22 am

Poodle wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:
Poodle wrote:Did the Swedish embassy ever reply to your request for legal aid against the nasty Jan?


Nope and we didn't expect them to but Sundberg and his wife stopped posting fraudulent articles about us and Paiva after that.


You know, boys, on this one I believe you. Whether or not you're telling the truth, I can honestly say that after you've stuck to your story for so long I find it impossible to think that you would have actually admitted to a hoax. So why on Earth, do you think, did Sundberg turn on you?

(No tricks or traps here, boys - I'm genuinely puzzled).


We won't admit it's a hoax because it's NOT a hoax.

Sundburg turned on Paiva and us because Sundburg hates Americans and he thought the only reason Paiva concluded our video contains images of large unknown serpentine marine animals was because Paiva and we are all Americans.

Sundberg hates Americans and he told us so many times in his emails to us,

Sundberg doesn't want Americans to be the first people to get a video of an actual sea serpent.

He wants to be the first person to get a video of an actual sea serpent.

Sundburg also turned on Paiva because in the past all of the photos and video that Sundburg took of what he claimed were sea serpents that he had Paiva analyze, Paiva concluded they were not sea serpents and even accused Sundberg of faking at least one of them.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:39 am

OK - I can see that might happen.

Working forward from that, do you think it possible that Paiva may feel much the same way - that he wants an American to be the first to get the video and he wants to be the guy who confirms it?

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:54 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote: Are you guys familiar with ( rattlesnake photo below) can bend its body 90 to 180 degrees?
Rattle snake.jpg
The rattlesnake weighs 2.3 kilos and has a diameter of 8 centimeters. Your hoax sea monster weighs 5,000 kilos and has a diameter of 66 centimeters (26 inches).


First, you KNOW that we told you at least two times that we never said the animal had a diameter of 26".

You KNOW the number 26 only relates to your formula when we said using 80 feet in your formula instead of 175 feet the result is the diameter of the body of an animal with uniform width would be closer to 26" not 13".

Since you are continuing to tell your lie that we said the animals we've seen have an upper body diameter of 26" then that proves to us that you are not an honest person.



Matthew Ellard wrote:Can you show me how you bend a 66cm tube to form the little black dots (individual birds) as seen in the still frame from your video?

Again, we've never claimed any of the animals we've seen has an upper body diameter of 66cm.

Regardless of the actual diameter of the upper portion of any of the animals, we have never claimed that the animals in our video are forming the same tight packet of folds that Bob's drawing which was posted in this thread by one of the members of this site depicts.

If fact we said many times the animal doesn't always create such radical folds in the upper portion of its body.

We're claiming the black objects in our video are the result of slight vertical undulations where the top of the undulation is just breaking the surface of the water.

It's impossible for anyone to say how these animals are able to do that without having a specimen to examine.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:57 am

Poodle wrote:OK - I can see that might happen.

Working forward from that, do you think it possible that Paiva may feel much the same way - that he wants an American to be the first to get the video and he wants to be the guy who confirms it?


The answer to both of your questions is "no".
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:03 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote: BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you. Here's your chance, Matthew. Go get him!


Firstly, as his revised 2005 report contains fundamental errors it has been removed as any form of evidence. There is nothing I need to ask him concerning this particular hoax.

Secondly, I am not going to debate Clifford Paiva in private.


That's your choice.

Matthew Ellard wrote:You two clowns came to this skeptic forum to have a public debate and got shredded.


In your dreams.

Matthew Ellard wrote:Clifford Paiva is most welcome to defend his honour and BSMRA here, in public. However you know he won't come here as the first questions will be about his use of film props as "evidence" and false claims in his "resume". As this thread is now a "hit" for Clifford Paiva on search engines, he's probably already getting worried. He has you two to thank.


Paiva's not worried about anything that's said about him on this site.

He's quite capable of defending himself.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:09 am

busterggi wrote:"You girls can contact Paiva directly using his email address."

Seriously, you think calling everyone who disagrees with you a girl is insulting? Are you two still in 2nd grade?


Do you think someone constantly calling two 66 year old men "boys" isn't deliberately meant to be insulting?

busterggi wrote:"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"
"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"
"FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY"

Even saying it three times won't make its magic work.


We bet you'll never forget that we had our first definitive sighting of a sea serpent in San Francisco Bay FROM ONLY 20 YARDS AWAY, will you?
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:12 am

Bill'nBob - Have you read the Moderated Discussions Policy in the relevant section of this forum? Would you and Clifford Paiva agree to carry on a discussion under those rules?

"Do you think someone constantly calling two 66 year old men "boys" isn't deliberately meant to be insulting?"

No, it isn't. I'm English. It's common to refer to any group of men as 'boys' - the boys at the pub, the boys from the black stuff, the colliery boys etc.
Last edited by Poodle on Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:13 am

Daedalus wrote:Why would we WANT to contact Paiva? I mean, other than the brief amusement that would ensue when he tried to explain the Pterodactyl bit, it seems kind of pointless.

Now Champagne, the fish food salesman... that could be fun. :lol:


Contacting either one of them is your choice not ours.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:17 am

Poodle wrote:Bill'nBob - Have you read the Moderated Discussions Policy in the relevant section of this forum? Would you and Clifford Paiva agree to carry on a discussion under those rules?


Paiva is not interested in coming here and discussing anything on this site.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:23 am

Then we are at an impasse, and Paiva appears to be avoiding discussion, not offering it.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:24 am

Poodle wrote:
sfseaserpent wrote:You girls can contact Paiva directly using his email address.


You must have misread my previous post. No one is likely to supply a man such as Clifford Paiva with an email address..."


That's your choice.

Poodle wrote:He's not as dumb as you, and knows that his invitation will not be taken up. He'll then find it easy to convince two dumbasses (that's you, boys) that it somehow means that he's "won". You are the only ones here openly dealing with a fraud.


We're not as dumb as you girls look.

Poodle wrote:Get your man onto this forum - in the Moderated Discussions section, where everyone has to behave. It's not too complicated to do, so he should be able to manage it.


We don't tell Paiva what to do. He's a free man.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby sfseaserpent » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:26 am

Poodle wrote:Then we are at an impasse, and Paiva appears to be avoiding discussion, not offering it.


You paint the picture any way you want to paint it.
"There cannot be the slightest doubt that you have had the chance sighting of an animal obviously unknown to science." ---Dr. Bernard Heuvelmans-- August 8, 1985

A skeptic is someone who sees the handwriting on the wall and claims it's a forgery.

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Re: Sea Serpents in San Francisco Bay!

Postby Poodle » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:30 am

"BTW, we heard from Paiva and he told us that any of you are welcome to contact him personally and he'll be glad to discuss his revised report with you."

... is the way Paiva painted it. There is, on this forum, a moderator-controlled section in which to have open discussions but in which personal attacks are not allowed. It appears to me to fit the bill perfectly.


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