Hospitals in camps.

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:42 am

>> I wouldn't take part on a forum where that kind of person could be seen as allied with me.

But he is happy to take part on a forum where the kind of person who posts about "big noses" and the like is allied with him.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Balmoral95 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:45 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:>> I wouldn't take part on a forum where that kind of person could be seen as allied with me.

But he is happy to take part on a forum where the kind of person who posts about "big noses" and the like is allied with him.

They like "alliances" and "winning" rhetoric.... poofs gaming...

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:51 am

. . . back to maternity wards in the Aktion Reinhard camps . . .
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Balmoral95 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:00 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:. . . back to maternity wards in the Aktion Reinhard camps . . .
Pick another camp, please: T2 stillborn. We should have all 6 finished with this pack of idioten by about February 2020.

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by montgomery » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:45 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:. . . back to maternity wards in the Aktion Reinhard camps . . .
Any camp of the size we've been talking about would need a hospital on site or at least close by. And in one case at least we have a former prisoner mentioning going to the hospital.

And so rather than "back to maternity wards in the AR camps..." It needs to be' back to the hospitals in the AR camps. And of course any camp which has women present, there will be a maternity ward somewhere in that hospital. Yet the drawings show no hospitals?? Is it possible that the hospitals have been mistaken for buildings with some other use?

Do you and your accomplices think you can just continue to scream, no it's not, no it's not, no it's not, and have that represent your side of the argument. You need to think twice because there is definite momentum these days of people asking more and more pointed questions about the holocaust. That is, if you actually care?

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by scrmbldggs » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:50 am

montgomery wrote:...

Any camp of the size we've been talking about would need a hospital on site or at least close by...
Nah, the perps cured their ills with booze and debauchery. No hospital needed for them to get their hangovers cured and uppers given.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:56 am

scrmbldggs wrote:
montgomery wrote:...

Any camp of the size we've been talking about would need a hospital on site or at least close by...
Nah, the perps cured their ills with booze and debauchery. No hospital needed for them to get their hangovers cured and uppers given.
What is he going on about? Any camp killing a few 1000s to 10,000 or so arriving prisoners a day would need an advanced state hospital with medical staff and maternity ward? That is supposed to be an argument?

Btw, "would" does not give confidence that the writer of this has even looked cursorily at the evidence.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:59 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Any camp killing a few 1000s to 10,000 or so arriving prisoners a day would need an advanced state hospital with medical staff and maternity ward? That is supposed to be an argument?
As no one was killed, no evidence. I wonder what you are on about. Horror stories only. I think you believe your own fabrications of reality. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Balmoral95 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:02 am

scrmbldggs wrote:
montgomery wrote:...

Any camp of the size we've been talking about would need a hospital on site or at least close by...
Nah, the perps cured their ills with booze and debauchery. No hospital needed for them to get their hangovers cured and uppers given.

Please think twice about the above. Please. Thank you. :lol:

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:11 am

VFX wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Any camp killing a few 1000s to 10,000 or so arriving prisoners a day would need an advanced state hospital with medical staff and maternity ward? That is supposed to be an argument?
As no one was killed, no evidence. I wonder what you are on about. Horror stories only. I think you believe your own fabrications of reality. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
What is meant by "no evidence":

https://books.google.se/books/about/The ... edir_esc=y
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-his ... teil.shtml
viewtopic.php?f=39&t=25127
viewtopic.php?f=39&t=22854
https://archive.org/details/BelzecSobib ... .ACritique
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot. ... of_22.html

Note that the poster is still shy about discussing Münzberger.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by scrmbldggs » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:14 am

S/he's getting really desperate now. Like when s/he was told there's no Santa...



Of course Münzberger is a favorite to dance around and away from. ;)
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:32 am

In this vein, to say a little more about how montgomery and VFX play out revisionist norms . . . when they aren't transparently dodging and trolling, using anti-Semitic tropes like "big nose" to address adversaries, or blatantly fabricating quotations, they play the "we can't discuss it because they won't discuss it the way we want to discuss it" game, as montgomery's done with Hans.

Take Wiernik. First mention of Wiernik after montgomery and VFX turned up here was in a post I made, after I'd linked to a piece that also discussed Wiernik. Crickets. Then Nessie mentioned Wiernik a couple times, finally suggesting montgomery read his book. Still crickets. Darren chimed in predicting how montgomery would deal with Wiernik. Finally montgomery decides to acknowledge Mr Wiernik - but in a curious manner: pretending that no one else would discuss Wiernik's testimony. And then, to cap it off, montgomery posts something from HDOT, unattributed, asks for comments, gets told he shouldn't crib from sources and that he should take Nessie's advice and read Wiernik's book ... to which montgomery gets all huffy!

That's revisionism for ya.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Balmoral95 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:38 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:In this vein, to say a little more about how montgomery and VFX play out revisionist norms . . . when they aren't transparently dodging and trolling, using anti-Semitic tropes like "big nose" to address adversaries, or blatantly fabricating quotations, they play the "we can't discuss it because they won't discuss it the way we want to discuss it" game, as montgomery's done with Hans.

Take Wiernik. First mention of Wiernik after montgomery and VFX turned up here was in a post I made, after I'd linked to a piece that also discussed Wiernik. Crickets. Then Nessie mentioned Wiernik a couple times, finally suggesting montgomery read his book. Still crickets. Darren chimed in predicting how montgomery would deal with Wiernik. Finally montgomery decides to acknowledge Mr Wiernik - but in a curious manner: pretending that no one else would discuss Wiernik's testimony. And then, to cap it off, montgomery posts something from HDOT, unattributed, asks for comments, gets told he shouldn't crib from sources and that he should take Nessie's advice and read Wiernik's book ... to which montgomery gets all huffy!

That's revisionism for ya.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Balmoral95 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:52 am

And the hospital records are where?

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by scrmbldggs » Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:18 am

They were sent with the resettling masses.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:25 am

Balmoral95 wrote:And the hospital records are where?
Maybe they are with the other 60 million real people who perished in this war, not the fantasy. Jews did die but as real men on the side of the Russians real men, women and children, fighting for their country. The others, so many of them survived and still counting shekel at the expense of the true heroes.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:34 am

VFX wrote:
Balmoral95 wrote:And the hospital records are where?
Maybe they are with the other 60 million real people who perished in this war, not the fantasy. Jews did die but as real men on the side of the Russians real men, women and children, fighting for their country. The others, so many of them survived and still counting shekel at the expense of the true heroes.
This is an old (silly) ejaculation often made by Nazis and deniers. Yes, anyone who has studied the war years knows that 10s of millions of people perished in WWII - through callousness, accidents, wartime operations, war crimes, inaccurate bombing, terrorism, unintended privation, etc, and there is a lot to be said about it. But only some groups, among them European Jews as a whole, were targeted for extermination.

Those who can't spot the difference between deaths arising in the course of war and intentional mass murder are hopeless. Of course, most deniers know the difference but try to blur necessary distinctions.

And, once again, VFX resorts to anti-Semitic language as his big boy words fail him and his arguments fall flat.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Nessie » Sun Sep 16, 2018 8:22 am

montgomery wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:. . . back to maternity wards in the Aktion Reinhard camps . . .
Any camp of the size we've been talking about would need a hospital on site or at least close by. And in one case at least we have a former prisoner mentioning going to the hospital.

And so rather than "back to maternity wards in the AR camps..." It needs to be' back to the hospitals in the AR camps. And of course any camp which has women present, there will be a maternity ward somewhere in that hospital. Yet the drawings show no hospitals?? Is it possible that the hospitals have been mistaken for buildings with some other use?

Do you and your accomplices think you can just continue to scream, no it's not, no it's not, no it's not, and have that represent your side of the argument. You need to think twice because there is definite momentum these days of people asking more and more pointed questions about the holocaust. That is, if you actually care?
To answer those questions you should look for evidence. Why are you not prepared to do that?

Then, when given answers and evidence, you ignore it. Why do you do that?

You profess to wanting to debate the evidence, but you comment far more on and participate in the abuse and bickering far more than you do on the evidence. Why is that?
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by BornAgainDisciple » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:14 pm

There was somekind of hospital in every camp or nearby for the SS and camp staff.
The SS personnel had to pass health examinations too every half a year or something like that.
There was also some sort of infirmaries or hospitals for prisoners also.
Denier favorite Otto Frank was treated in one of those at Birkenau.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:20 pm

Thank you for putting matters in the correct perspective without the horror stories.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by BornAgainDisciple » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:32 pm

Well, that is the "basic knowledge" of camp hospitals and without going off-topic.
As an addition, every hospital/infirmary had their own appointed doctors on duty. Same thing with
lagerführers and such. Prisoners had often prisoner doctors to treat them.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:40 pm

Going off topic here is a common theme to derail but this is OK... Yes every camp had proper medical facilities. There were many prisoner doctors who were given adequate supplies until the breakdown of the system at the end. However despite this Typhus was still rampant but the war I guess prevented the necessary resources from going to the camps. That terrible war certainly brought out the worst and perhaps the best in people. The real tragedy is that there was no need for this war, it was entirely preventable. However what is done is done.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by BornAgainDisciple » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:53 pm

There is also the curious case of Dr. Hans Münch, the 'Good Man of Auschwitz'.
He was the only person acquitted of war crimes at the 1947 Auschwitz trials and some inmates even defended him.
I wonder if he still had some dark secrets.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:01 pm

BornAgainDisciple wrote:There is also the curious case of Dr. Hans Münch, the 'Good Man of Auschwitz'.
He was the only person acquitted of war crimes at the 1947 Auschwitz trials and some inmates even defended him.
I wonder if he still had some dark secrets.
The spin put on Dr Münch was that he was "insane" so his testimony was discounted: as a corollary to this he could not be charged either. His testimony would have been damming to the prosecution or they could have spun it up more to have him executed. He passed away in 2011. Thank you for reminding me about Dr Münch
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by BornAgainDisciple » Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

Münch worked approx. 4 km outside the camp in Hygiene Institute and did not take part in selections,
so there wasn't other reasons to keep him in prison than being a part of criminal organization (SS).
He was still one of the doctors working in the vast Auschwitz complex.
His reputation is much better than his personal friend Mengele's and their colleagues (Wirths, Thilo...).
He might have been suffering from dementia in his later years and we don't know everything about him.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by VFX » Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

BornAgainDisciple wrote:Münch worked approx. 4 km outside the camp in Hygiene Institute and did not take part in selections,
so there wasn't other reasons to keep him in prison than being a part of criminal organization (SS).
He was still one of the doctors working in the vast Auschwitz complex.
His reputation is much better than his personal friend Mengele's and their colleagues (Wirths, Thilo...).
He might have been suffering from dementia in his later years and we don't know everything about him.
Of course the majority of the Ss were not criminals but some were; in this case the victor decided in the after math with somewhat extreme bias. The Waffen-Ss want their name cleared and their medals restored. I certainly think that Dr Mengele was demonized for propaganda purposes and there were no gassing incidents in Auschwitz; most likely this was also Soviet propaganda. There is more of this elsewhere. The real issues for everyone, especially inmates was the breakdown of the infra structure towards the end when there was no food, medicine just bombs. We were not there and so can only speculate on the horror. If the war was not declared non of this crap would have happened: that is the great tragedy with hindsight bias. If other people became leader of National Socialist German Workers Party none of this would have happened either. Hey nice talking to you. Shalom.
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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by montgomery » Sun Sep 30, 2018 4:21 pm

VFX wrote:
BornAgainDisciple wrote:Münch worked approx. 4 km outside the camp in Hygiene Institute and did not take part in selections,
so there wasn't other reasons to keep him in prison than being a part of criminal organization (SS).
He was still one of the doctors working in the vast Auschwitz complex.
His reputation is much better than his personal friend Mengele's and their colleagues (Wirths, Thilo...).
He might have been suffering from dementia in his later years and we don't know everything about him.
Of course the majority of the Ss were not criminals but some were; in this case the victor decided in the after math with somewhat extreme bias. The Waffen-Ss want their name cleared and their medals restored. I certainly think that Dr Mengele was demonized for propaganda purposes and there were no gassing incidents in Auschwitz; most likely this was also Soviet propaganda. There is more of this elsewhere. The real issues for everyone, especially inmates was the breakdown of the infra structure towards the end when there was no food, medicine just bombs. We were not there and so can only speculate on the horror. If the war was not declared non of this crap would have happened: that is the great tragedy with hindsight bias. If other people became leader of National Socialist German Workers Party none of this would have happened either. Hey nice talking to you. Shalom.
Victors justice is always a factor but I've come to appreciate just how much the crimes of the Nazis have been exaggerated.

But I think that after 75 years the people of the world are ready to break free and start to accept some of the truths put forward by those such as the H.D.'ers. Maybe the biggest motivator of all is Trump and the evil he represents. That evil is becoming a representation of America and that causes trust in America to be eroded. And I think that after Trump, America won't change for the good. The die is cast and America is beginning to stand against the rest of the world in so many ways.

Without America supporting and promoting more holocaust lies, the legend will be threatened as never before. There are just too many lies and exaggerations to fall back on, for which to seriously question. And incidentally, isn't Kavanaugh the glaring example of America's becoming completely and totally, laughably corrupt?

Just imagine this corrupt and hateful biased animal becoming a judge on the hight court in the land, within the world's greatest country.

And this is the country that is the greatest promoter of the holocaust lies!

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Jeff_36 » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:16 am

montgomery wrote: The Waffen-Ss want their name cleared and their medals restored.


No, they most certifiably did not. many were justly tried and sentenced for war crimes - I encourage you to look up the 12th SS Division's crimes against commonwealth POW's in Normandy for example. The HAIG union was founded to restore SS pensions - the failed, thankfully.
Without America supporting and promoting more holocaust lies, the legend will be threatened as never before.
Unfortunately America has institutional checks and balances in place to prevent this type of thing from happening. Even with Trump in office the desired outcome that the alt-right wishes to see has not come to fruition.

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by Jeff_36 » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:22 am

VFX wrote:
BornAgainDisciple wrote:There is also the curious case of Dr. Hans Münch, the 'Good Man of Auschwitz'.
He was the only person acquitted of war crimes at the 1947 Auschwitz trials and some inmates even defended him.
I wonder if he still had some dark secrets.
The spin put on Dr Münch was that he was "insane" so his testimony was discounted: as a corollary to this he could not be charged either. His testimony would have been damming to the prosecution or they could have spun it up more to have him executed. He passed away in 2011. Thank you for reminding me about Dr Münch
Dr. Munch suffered from dementia later in life and as a result he began betraying uncomfortable truths - that he had partaken in selections, and that he had euthanized patients. He made racist comments about gypsies and expressed no regret for their plight. Such startling admissions of his inner thoughts would naturally have come with admission of nonexistence of gas chambers if that were the case - but that was not the case, he explicitly referenced mass gassings in his last statements. That is as convincing evidence as can be found anywhere.

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Re: Hospitals in camps.

Post by BornAgainDisciple » Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:08 am

"Münch was assigned to the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS which was about 3-4 km. outside the Auschwitz camp."
"At the Institute, Münch was involved in experiments with typhus. He was also responsible for "keeping the barracks more healthy".
In that role he did visit the camp, on occasion. His primary work, however, was done at the Institute."

"The doctor at headquarters, that is the chief of the medical staff at Auschwitz, told me that I had to cooperate, three times a week or whatever,
had to spend one night making selections...I went to Berlin immediately to the head of the hygiene institute and told him "I cannot do it. I will not do it,
regardless of the consequences." And, he said, "Yes, he can understand, and he'll talk with the camp commander and the chief of staff at Auschwitz."
With this move, Münch removed himself from making selections."

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/hans-m-uuml-nch

So it is unclear if he was at selections at all.
He did however sign the death certificates.

Kurt Gerstein also worked for the Hygiene Institute of the Waffen SS.
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