Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Holocaust denial and related subjects.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed May 23, 2018 4:54 pm

When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed May 23, 2018 11:46 pm

perhaps surprising research conclusions on basis of support for authoritarianism in the US and Europe:
Across Europe and North America, support for democracy is in decline. To explain this trend, conventional wisdom points to the political extremes. Both the far left and the far right are, according to this view, willing to ride roughshod over democratic institutions to achieve radical change. Moderates, by contrast, are assumed to defend liberal democracy, its principles and institutions.

The numbers indicate that this isn’t the case. As Western democracies descend into dysfunction, no group is immune to the allure of authoritarianism — least of all centrists, who seem to prefer strong and efficient government over messy democratic politics.

Strongmen in the developing world have historically found support in the center: From Brazil and Argentina to Singapore and Indonesia, middle-class moderates have encouraged authoritarian transitions to bring stability and deliver growth. Could the same thing happen in mature democracies like Britain, France and the United States?
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu May 24, 2018 12:27 am

Nothing new under the sun.....

We saw the same thing in the 1930's while the Great Depression raged.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu May 24, 2018 12:28 am

Only this time this is occurring in the United States.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri May 25, 2018 10:57 pm

a bit off topic but I don't know where else to put this: "The exit polls say that Ireland has voted to legalize abortion with a smashing majority" (the vote count appears to be confirming exit polling: "Irish abortion referendum: Save the 8th campaign concedes defeat – live" (buried in this story is the fact that the evangelical right and Trumpists in the US overplayed their hand in backing "save the 8th" campaign; before the vote I was reading that American right-wing Christians were a possible influencer for defeating the "yes" question)
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun May 27, 2018 6:49 pm

Having just read where Rudy G went completely hatstand today, admitting of Trump's spying charges, “Of course we have to do it to defend the president. . . . It is for public opinion,” or, “ wibble, wibble,” I saw the latest on Italy in The Grauniadl:
Italy’s premier-designate has told the president he has been unable to form what would have been western Europe’s first populist government, potentially paving the way for fresh elections.

A presidential palace official told reporters on Sunday night that Giuseppe Conte “has given back the mandate” to try to form a government that President Sergio Mattarella gave him four days earlier.

Conte, a little-known law professor with no political experience, took his list of ministers to President Sergio Mattarella, but the president rejected Conte’s candidate to the economy ministry, the 81-year-old Eurosceptic economist Paolo Savona. Mattarella is staunchly pro-Europe.

And then I also found a piece in same on how all's well in Europe: "Thousands from far right and Berlin's techno scene face off in rival rallies: German police deployed to keep anti-immigration AfD group and counter-protesters apart and avoid clashes."
One of the loudest counter-demonstrations was organised by some 100 clubs from Berlin’s legendary techno scene, who were using boats and floats on the River Spree and a convoy of DJ-carrying trucks to “bass away” the AfD.

“The Berlin club culture is everything that Nazis are not,” the group said in a statement. “We are progressive, queer, feminist, anti-racist, inclusive, colourful and we have unicorns.”

Although the vast majority of counter-demonstrations were expected to be peaceful, members of the far-left ntifa movement had on their website called for “chaos”, urging sympathisers “to sabotage the AfD rally using all necessary means”.

Berlin police have deployed 2,000 officers, drafted in from across Germany, to keep the peace.

It seems that the counter-demo by various leftists exceeded the size of the AfD protest. I mean, they "have unicorns," so they will triumph!

As to the US and the insane Rudy G, recall that
On June 14, 2018, the DOJ will file a sworn affidavit in ongoing FOIA litigation addressing to what extent the FBI ever investigated leaks made to Rudy from the FBI during the campaign.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun May 27, 2018 7:03 pm

I will be in Sweden when this year's elections are held, 9 September. The latest Poll of Polls shows further slippage for the Social Democrats, further gain by the Sweden Democrats, a new gain by the Left, and a drop by the Center party:

Government (38% n/c)
Social Democrats 25% (-1 pt)
Left 9% (+1 pt)
Greens 4% (n/c)

Opposition Alliance (40% -1%)
Moderaterna 22% (n/c)
Liberals 5% (n/c)
Christian Democrats 4% (n/c)
Center 9% (-1 pt)

Sweden Democrats 19% (+1 pt)
Feminist Initiative 2% (n/c) (I've listed this as "other" previously)

Undecided/? 1% (n/c pt)
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon May 28, 2018 10:02 pm

the American model in practice in the UK (people I know in Sweden refer to the British model as continuing possible debacle, promoted there by the Moderaterna)
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Mon May 28, 2018 10:09 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:the American model in practice in the UK (people I know in Sweden refer to the British model as continuing possible debacle, promoted there by the Moderaterna)



Yet if people keep voting for it will continue. Same thing for the US.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon May 28, 2018 10:26 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:Yet if people keep voting for it will continue. Same thing for the US.

OTOH the German left could send some of their unicorns, and everything will turn up roses.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Tue May 29, 2018 10:13 am

You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu May 31, 2018 7:46 pm

Lega and the 5 Star Movement have reached an agreement on a political deal which they assume will be approved by Italy's president, replacing the economics minister in their original government but not the PM. I take it that the far-right Lega blinked as they seem positioned to improve significantly against their senior partner M5S in any new elections.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:25 pm

Andrew Sullivan on what's next (hint: he doesn't see much likelihood of a reversion to the "normal" world of liberal democracy)
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:42 pm

Rather than emerging as the heroic savior of liberalism - or as "the President who dragged France kicking and screaming into the 21st century" and as the man who, with his political partner Angela Merkel, re-invigorated the European project - Emmanuel Macron may well be remembered as a flatulent generation's last gaseous release. As Barack Obama wondered, “what if we were wrong?”
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Jun 01, 2018 11:14 pm

Bannon, in his sodden wisdom, has visited Italy and foresees a coalition of Sanders supporters, most of whom despise Trump and Bannon and all they stand for, and Trumpistas as the future. I think the copious alcohol made him equate Bernie with Beppo . . . I will grant him Lega = GOP.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:49 am

I really don’t know where else to put this.....
http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/260637/robert-faurisson-holocaust-denial

It’s not really worth its own thread but it is interesting.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Jun 03, 2018 1:06 pm

You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:53 pm

You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:59 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:“Nazis need no bathing fun!”

Image



“Yes, we accept responsibility for those 12 years,” Gauland said. “But, dear friends, Hitler and the Nazis are just a speck of birds--t in over 1,000 years of successful German history.”


Successful????????
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:10 am

I think that that was a reference to the better aspects of the Weimar Republic.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:11 am

It's not just Bloatus. Here's Heather Nauert, a State Dept spokesperson worthy of Sean Spicer, reassuring the world that despite recent conflicts (trade, Iran, and especially the troubled brief tenure of the new US ambassador Richard Grennell) the US has "a very strong relationship with the government of Germany. Looking back in the history books, today is the 71st anniversary of the speech that announced the Marshall Plan. Tomorrow is the anniversary of the D-Day invasion. We obviously have a very long history with the government of Germany. And we have a strong relationship with the government of Germany.."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politic ... story.html
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 4:09 am

When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:19 pm

Macronization - when alpha males get all alpha-y:

Image
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Balsamo » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:08 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:I think that that was a reference to the better aspects of the Weimar Republic.


Actually, this shit-hole was referring to 1000 years of German history. And of course, in a 1000 years perspective, 12 years of Nazism is not much...I am not sure, he felt that way when making is provocation though.
As for the "successful" i guess that it will be hard to find another examples of States that are still number one in their region after having lost 2 world wars within a century.

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:04 pm

Balsamo wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:I think that that was a reference to the better aspects of the Weimar Republic.


Actually, this shit-hole was referring to 1000 years of German history. . . .

That was an attempt at a joke, Weimar having a certain appeal that the subsequent 12-Year Reich lacked . . . sorry.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:57 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Balsamo wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:I think that that was a reference to the better aspects of the Weimar Republic.


Actually, this shit-hole was referring to 1000 years of German history. . . .

That was an attempt at a joke, Weimar having a certain appeal that the subsequent 12-Year Reich lacked . . . sorry.



Hey, Red Berlin was a happening place.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Jun 10, 2018 11:41 am

feeling the love, in Canada . . .

Image
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:40 pm

I managed to find a copy of the G7 photo BEFORE someone cleaned it up with Photoshop:

Image
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:59 pm

LOL
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:05 pm

On Fox & Friends, co-host Abby Huntsman tries putting these happenings into perspective, turning attention to this week's meeting between Kim Jong Un and Donald Trump and telling The Mooch: “Regardless of what happens in that meeting between the two dictators, what we are seeing right now ― this is history.”
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:12 pm

In polling for September’s elections in Sweden, the right-leaning Moderaterna have lost a point since the last update of the Poll of Polls, whilst the populist/formerly-neo-fascist Sweden Democrats have gained two points: the Moderaterna and Sweden Democrats are now tied for 2nd in the polling, with each party at 21% to the Social Democrats' 25%. Also, the Christian Democrats lost a point in the most recent Poll of Polls. All other parties have held steady - except for the Feminist Initiative whose result is now close to 1%.

Since March of this year the Sweden Democrats have gained about 6 points, and the Social Democrats - largest party in Sweden - have lost 3-4 points.

The governing coalition polls at about 40%; the opposition Alliance is at 39%. Neither would be likely to be able to form a government without the Sweden Democrats - and both have ruled out a government with the Sweden Democrats.

The key themes in the campaign are those promoted by Sweden's far right (the Sweden Democrats and neo-Nazis) - migration and refugees, despite an 80% drop in asylum in applications from 2015 to 2017, and rising crime. The Social Democrats have moved significantly to the right on immigration over the past few years.

At this point it appears that Sweden will be another case of electoral disruption from the far right - and that in Sweden this fall post-election maneuvering could be more intense and more fraught than the general election itself. I say "could be" because the election may also bring surprises: the Sweden Democrats generally have polled worse than their eventual election results.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon Jun 11, 2018 3:20 pm

On how the US fits in to all this, Jeffrey Goldberg in The Atlantic quotes a senior Trump administration's explication of the Trump view of the world: “The Trump Doctrine is, ‘We’re America, Bitch.’ That’s the Trump Doctrine.” A second official, asked whether the attitude and associated actions don't destabilize US allies more than adversaries, elaborated, “They’ll see over time that it doesn’t pay to argue with us.”
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:34 pm

LOL, yeah, this is theme song for the Trump presidency:
https://youtu.be/DOEIruwzf54
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:27 pm

peace, love & understanding . . . finding the love . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGvHnDeS12o
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:04 pm

It ain't just Europe, part 323: Steve King, Iowa Republican and nativist loon, has retweeted a British neo-Nazi, Mark Collett, on Italy Awake! King wrote, “Europe is waking up… Will America… in time?”
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:48 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:It ain't just Europe, part 323: Steve King, Iowa Republican and nativist loon, has retweeted a British neo-Nazi, Mark Collett, on Italy Awake! King wrote, “Europe is waking up… Will America… in time?”


Some of the comments on his tweet made me smile...and feel hopeful at the same time.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:49 pm

Waking up, getting Red pilled....results are the same.

Have we seen anything like this since the 1930’s?
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:51 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:It ain't just Europe, part 323: Steve King, Iowa Republican and nativist loon, has retweeted a British neo-Nazi, Mark Collett, on Italy Awake! King wrote, “Europe is waking up… Will America… in time?”


Posted this in the Trump thread:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/13/politics/donald-trump-mark-sanford-corey-stewart/index.html

It scares the crap out of me, what Trump pried open with his tiny hands.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
Edith Baneth
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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:29 pm

May be time to give up that little bit of hope: GOP still silent about King’s retweet, plus the primary results you mention; the US doesn’t have “room” for an AfD or League when it has the one of its two major parties in the grips of ethno-nationalism.
You know, my dear Colonel General, I don't really believe that the Russians will attack at all. It's all an enormous bluff. - Heinrich Himmler to Heinz Guderian, December 1944

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Re: Populism and Nationalism in Europe Today

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:49 pm

I will wait to see what happens in November. That may kill any hope I have left.
When my son had his barmitzvah, and his wedding, there was no family whatsoever -that’s the way the second and third generation feel the Holocaust, they miss their family. My son hasn’t experienced a family life –having uncles, aunts, grandmothers, grandfathers. There is just that hole.
Edith Baneth
Savage Continent


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