Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Holocaust denial and related subjects.
User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:45 am

Whose hand is that? LOL
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:26 pm

EtienneSC replied on Pollack-Ohlendorf-Browning-Goldhagen . . . and I now see what he did, even though his page references to Goldhagen are not helpful to me (I have a different edition of the Goldhagen book I think but found what must be the Ohlendorf reference by using the index, duh). Although I see what EtienneSC did, I still have no idea what his point was.

I can't post my reply because ISF is not responding. "Failed to open page" message. I will drop a long post at ISF when their server problem is rectified. For now, EtienneSC (and Pollack and to some extent Goldhagen) confused a statement Ohlendorf made about superior orders - that he dismissed on his own initiative men unfit for killing because of their mental state - with the situations in which men tried to opt out or refused orders. Again, what the heck EtienneSC was trying to say, I can't figure out. But he was equating apples to oranges to make his non-point.

EtienneSC, for all his pomposity, isn't that clear in his thinking.

And - back to the topic of this thread - EtienneSC, like Monstrous, has gone totally quiet on Rudolf's shitty little CODOH article. I've asked them both directly for a response; neither has so much as acknowledged the request I made.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Kleon_I XYZ Contagion
Poster
Posts: 349
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:06 pm
Contact:

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Kleon_I XYZ Contagion » Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:00 pm

I think internationalskeptics.com/forums is down. I can't open it too (and it's not because I'm in the other half hemisphere) :)
According to experts and scholars, the 10 stages of every genocide are
Classification Symbolization Discrimination Dehumanization Organization Polarization Preparation Persecution Extermination
... and finally the 10th stage:
Denial
http://www.genocidewatch.org/genocide/t ... ocide.html

XYZ Contagion (‘Because the truth is contagious‘), an investigative/research political and historical website, deals also with the Srebrenica Genocide
https://xyzcontagion.wordpress.com/about/#English

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:09 pm

Kleon_I XYZ Contagion wrote:I think internationalskeptics.com/forums is down. I can't open it too (and it's not because I'm in the other half hemisphere) :)

It couldn't process EtienneSC's word salads, too much fluff gummed up the works.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:36 pm

Kleon_I XYZ Contagion wrote:I think internationalskeptics.com/forums is down. I can't open it too (and it's not because I'm in the other half hemisphere) :)


When this happened last Summer (ah, last Summer. Back when the world was a brighter place) we all thought that the sheer weight of the Rizoli brothers stupidity broke it.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:01 am

And we're back and EtienneSC has finally responded on Rothstein and other topics. As I had no class to run off to tonight, I've replied :)
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:57 am

And Ivanesca has posted a LOT more about the Fleming book/British reactions to reports from Poland . . . and spelled out the basic flaw in EtienneSC's linked article . . .
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:58 am

For Monstrous' benefit I am posting EtienneSC's current thoughts about Rudolf's Rothstein argument:
Rudolf offers a weak argument for how the supposed same Rothstein would have had to travel from Treblinka to Minsk. It seems to be wishful thinking rather than a lie. I have nothing to add myself.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:14 am

OTOH I may be absenting myself from ISF after having pulled a yellow card for this innocuous post, describing a school of denial and then showing how EtienneSC exemplified parts of it:
Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Isn't ESC demonstrating nearly classic denial?

Yes, of the "I'm a profound" thinker/JAQing off school, under cover of feigned erudition, a show of broad-mindedness, and simulated soul searching. That's where the Just Askin' for this sort of denier comes in - only ESC is just askin' what's easily discoverable and he must know that people here are among those who know it well.

Members of this school marshal pretension and ersatz intellectual curiosity to try making misreadings and sleights of hand sound like deep thinking - and to trick casual readers. Likewise ESC can't bring himself to grasp the most basic points in key works and he just has to mischaracterize them to find straw men to knock down.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:33 am

LOL

I've been red carded twice at RODOH, I win.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:53 am

I like this place better - they really stifle conversation over there. And I cannot figure out the limits. I rewrote that sucker several times to really slam the school of deniers and then say how EtienneSC uses its methods.

You win, but, well, Rodoh is kindly to people telling deniers the facts of life.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:01 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:I like this place better - they really stifle conversation over there. And I cannot figure out the limits. I rewrote that sucker several times to really slam the school of deniers and then say how EtienneSC uses its methods.

You win, but, well, Rodoh is kindly to people telling deniers the facts of life.


I don't like the setup. I pop over now and again to have a look.
I guess depth check doesn't like the honesty, I simply pointed out that SFinesilver is a nafcash shill. Which he/she is.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:07 am

Yeah, format and moderation both suck.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeff_36
Perpetual Poster
Posts: 4475
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:45 pm
Location: At the hundredth meridian, where the great plains begin

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:25 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Whose hand is that? LOL


Not Trump's. :lol:

User avatar
Jeff_36
Perpetual Poster
Posts: 4475
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:45 pm
Location: At the hundredth meridian, where the great plains begin

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:26 am

ESC wrote:It does not surprise me that there would be several people of the same name born in the same place. I have come across this myself with old birth/death records.


is he capable of feeling shame?

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:36 am

The Jewish population of Kitzingen - I will post this but am still irked about not being permitted to discuss HD, its characteristics, etc - was in the 100s during the late 1800s (337 in 1880). The chances of there being 4 Siegmund Rothsteins born there in 1867 are practically equivalent to zero. Crap I will post that now . . . sigh.

What pisses me off so much about being moderated for posting on HD is this: people develop schools of thought, communities of interest and approach. HD is one of them. The thread is dedicated to discussion of HD. Yet the moderating team in some twisted logic has decided that discussion of the thread topic-HD-is an ad hominem. Total {!#%@} BS.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:22 pm

Anyone invited EtienneSC to come here?

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:22 pm

Not me. I haven't.

I am considering a post explaining to him that I won't be participating any longer in a forum called "General Holocaust denial discussion" which explicitly bans discussion of, er, the characteristics of Holocaust denial and Holocaust deniers. And telling him where the discussion can be continued.

But, of course, the moderators would delete such a post as a violation of the rules under Appeals & Complaints.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:46 pm

Which reminds me: All hail Pyrrho. Along with Joe Future, the best forum moderator I've encountered anywhere. He lets us go at it but never allows things to get out of hand.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:59 pm

If no one objects I will. I stay logged in at ISF for convenience but I'd rather have those conversations here. We can pick individual subjects out rather than trying to randomly discuss things in one long thread.

User avatar
NathanC
Poster
Posts: 491
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:19 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby NathanC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:28 pm

By all means go ahead. I (Ivanesca) am starting to lose interest in "debating" the guy because as pointed out, he basically waits for things to die down before spouting the same BS again and again, and again. And after LeoM and StatMech exposed his lies, I've lost even more interest. I really hate it when they lie to my face.

At least if he's here, I'm finally able to call him out as the ignorant, dishonest piece of {!#%@} that he is.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:32 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:If no one objects I will. I stay logged in at ISF for convenience but I'd rather have those conversations here. We can pick individual subjects out rather than trying to randomly discuss things in one long thread.

I don't object. :)
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:38 pm

I'll check, when he pops up again I'll pass it along.

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:48 pm

I sent him a PM.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:02 pm

If he agrees I will put a note in the thread, maybe we can bring a few more folks here/

My guess is he will not agree.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:04 pm

By the way, Monstrous, yes, you are a ridiculous little person. But even though EtienneSC threw in the towel on Rudolf's article, and called it "weak," we'd still welcome your responses.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
NathanC
Poster
Posts: 491
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:19 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby NathanC » Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:20 pm

   
Statistical Mechanic wrote:By the way, Monstrous, yes, you are a ridiculous little person. But even though EtienneSC threw in the towel on Rudolf's article, and called it "weak," we'd still welcome your responses.


I wouldn't call it "throwing the towel". He won't admit that Rudolf lied, and tries to downplay it by saying that it was only "wishful thinking". The dude loves to accuse HC and real scholars of "lying", but he can't bring himself to admit that St. Rudolf (and other Deniers) are the only ones shown to be lying in the discussion.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:39 pm

NathanC wrote:I wouldn't call it "throwing the towel". He won't admit that Rudolf lied, and tries to downplay it by saying that it was only "wishful thinking". The dude loves to accuse HC and real scholars of "lying", but he can't bring himself to admit that St. Rudolf (and other Deniers) are the only ones shown to be lying in the discussion.

Well yes, I am still going back at him on the dishonesty - but he did give up on the article (as weak and a case of, er, what he sometimes accuses Holocaust scholars of) after recommending it, which is more than Monstrous could muster. I doubt EtienneSC will be further defending of again recommending that particular CODOH piece in the future, even as he tries salvaging Rudolf.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:17 pm

ISF has gone silent. My last post was about Rudolf's attempted deceit with Rothstein. Hey Jeffk, did you ask EtienneSC about continuing the proceedings here?
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:21 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:ISF has gone silent. My last post was about Rudolf's attempted deceit with Rothstein. Hey Jeffk, did you ask EtienneSC about continuing the proceedings here?


Yes, I sent him a PM, he never replied back.

User avatar
Darren Wilshak
Poster
Posts: 468
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2012 1:16 pm

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Darren Wilshak » Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:23 pm

Probably he is just a weird troll. He gets a clue then he goes away and repeats the same again.

User avatar
NathanC
Poster
Posts: 491
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 9:19 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby NathanC » Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:39 am

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:ISF has gone silent. My last post was about Rudolf's attempted deceit with Rothstein. Hey Jeffk, did you ask EtienneSC about continuing the proceedings here?


Yes, I sent him a PM, he never replied back.


Image

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:40 am

NathanC wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:ISF has gone silent. My last post was about Rudolf's attempted deceit with Rothstein. Hey Jeffk, did you ask EtienneSC about continuing the proceedings here?


Yes, I sent him a PM, he never replied back.


Image


:lol:

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:40 am

I don't go there everyday, if you see him there send him the invitation.

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:27 am

Checked in at ISF, appears that EtienneSC has left the field on this one, no one is defending Rudolf here, either.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed Mar 29, 2017 6:25 am

Thanks to Jeffk's linking to a Rodoh thread on "transit/resettlement" we learn that a) been-there has offered up Rothstein as a case in response to Roberto Muehlenkamp's challenge, b) Sergey Romanov has written a HC piece on Rothstein with more information than we covered here and at ISF, and c) since Sergey's piece was posted in the Rodoh thread, Gerdes has spammed the thread - and Werd and Orion have posted about whether Nessie believes Korherr and the lack of results in YV database for trains departing Auschwitz, both off topic to Rothstein. It will be interesting to see if been-there replies to Sergey's HC piece.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Statistical Mechanic
Has No Life
Posts: 16027
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:19 pm
Custom Title: Dostawca - sciany tekstu
Location: still in Greater Tomainia

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:39 pm

been-there bothered to reply and made it clear that he either didn't look at the records Sergey (Jeff_36, and I) have pointed to or is incapable of understanding them. I am quoting the reply here because it is so precious and so unintentionally self-revealing:
As predicted, “anything which 'falsifies' the cherished belief-system is either ignored, or if it can't be ignored then is justified in some dishonest, delusional manner.”

And here is that dishonest, delusional justification, encapsulated in this sentence:
“The only thing that Boisdefeau found were two contradictory informational streams that did not even intersect (i.e. the sources that say he went to Minsk don't say he went through Treblinka and vice versa).”

The obvious alternative interpretation, is that the entries do NOT contradict, but complement.
Occams razor. The true-believer 'needs' and 'desires' these documents to be mistakes BECAUSE they 'conflict'. But they ONLY conflict or contradict IF you have an a priori belief with a related and desired specific result or conclusion to reach.
They are ONLY presumed to be 'contradictory' documents because holocaust defenders/true-believers choose not to believe them in this specific case. And why? Well because it refutes their belief-system. That is the ONLY reason why they reject this evidence.
Two sources, for the same guy. Same age, same name, same birth town, etc. If these so-called 'contradictory' documents are BOTH regarded as being accurate, then the conclusion is clear, simple and obvious. Rothstein WAS transported to Trebinka. He DID die in Minsk. Therefore Treblinka was NOT a death camp for him but a transit camp.
Q.E.D.

Falsifies? Hell, Rudolf's crap didn't even make it out of the starting gate.

note to been-there: there are 4 YV records on Siegmund (Zigmund) Rothstein from Kitzingen (Mainfranken), born there in 1867 - and there is no way, from what I've seen presented by Boisdefu or Rudolf or been-there to say what's accurate and what's not:

- record #10760945 has Rothstein deported not from Theresienstadt but from “Kitzingen, Kitzingen (Mainfranken), Bavaria” to Minsk, where he died - no date. That is, not to Theresienstadt or to Treblinka.

- record #4129032 says that Rothstein was deported on transport I/37 from Berlin to Theresienstadt on I/37 on 4 August 1942, then perished in Minsk, no date provided, no mention of Treblinka.

- record #4911011 has Rothstein deported from Berlin to Theresienstadt on I/37 on 4 August 1942, then from Therksienstadt to Treblinka on 26 September 1942, no mention of Minsk.

- record #11619891 has Rothstein deported to Theresienstadt (no transport #) on 4 August 1942 and from Theresienstadt to Treblinka on 26 September 1942), no mention of Minsk.

(Nessie has found a 5th YV record, #10784457, which is like #10760945.)

As Sergey wrote, there is no source that connects the Minsk and Treblinka records. So been-there merely asserts such a connection and then sounds off about it and Occam's razor! Sergey also gave an explanation for confusion about transport Br, which been-there also doesn't answer. So been-there has no actual answer for Sergey, Jeff_36, or me.

All this has been posted here and at ISF. Any link between the itineraries in the 4 records, and any sequence, is invented and not found in the records themselves. been-there's not engaged with the evidence so he gives one of his scolding lectures that amounts to nothing. Been-there presents no evidence that the records are connected or sequenced: he just connects them because he wants them connected. They could be connected, he says, so let's connect them and sequence them. Lol been-there can always be counted on for goofy stuff.

Which Roberto pointed out later in the thread, answering been-there's question "How about an answer to my point Roberto?"
What "point"?

You would have a point if there were sources suggesting a transport from Treblinka to Minsk.

What you have is some sources claiming that Rothstein was on a transport from Theresienstadt to Minsk and died in Minsk, others (including the one under http://www.bundesarchiv.de/gedenkbuch/de1145488) claiming that he was on a transport from Theresienstadt to Treblinka and died in Treblinka ("26. September 1942, Treblinka, Vernichtungslager"). And no evidence that transports to Minsk from Theresienstadt got anywhere close to Treblinka. So one of set of sources must be wrong as concerns Rothstein's destination. As simple as that.

been-there's reply is to request of Roberto sources as proofs of points which Roberto had just posted aren't provable and then to fabricate the routes for trains from Theresienstadt to Minsk, to get the trains to Malkinia, which routes do not match the itineraries for these trains stated in Yad Vashem database, which been-there could have consulted instead of drawing a "creative" route onto a map.

Sigh, I'd forgotten how tiresome been-there gets. Especially when perched on his high horse.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

User avatar
Jeffk 1970
Has More Than 5K Posts
Posts: 5750
Joined: Tue May 31, 2016 3:00 am

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:56 pm

If these so-called 'contradictory' documents are BOTH regarded as being accurate, then the conclusion is clear, simple and obvious. Rothstein WAS transported to Trebinka. He DID die in Minsk. Therefore Treblinka was NOT a death camp for him but a transit camp.


:rotfl:

Yes, that's exactly it.

:rotfl:

This is why he made the list. He may move up the list.

What been-there and the others can't get through their thick skulls is that an anomaly here and an anamoly there do not equal proof. What we have is a matter of contradictory records for one person....but, we have hundreds of thousands of people sent to that camp. There should be an equal amount of records for them if they left for another destination.

So, no, this is not proof of a transit camp...this looks like a screw up in the record keeping.

Xcalibur
Frequent Poster
Posts: 1434
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:56 pm

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Xcalibur » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:44 am

Yeah, but nobody ever said been-there is nothing other than a useless, ignorant, whining {!#%@}.

Left out "anti-semitic" cuz it's self-evident.

Xcalibur
Frequent Poster
Posts: 1434
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:56 pm

Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Xcalibur » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:54 am

As well the point that he's profoundly boring.


Return to “Holocaust Denial”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest