Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

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Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Monstrous » Thu Mar 02, 2017 2:05 pm

http://codoh.com/library/document/4239/
http://codoh.com/library/document/4230/

The revisionists really take down the Believers on population number ridiculousness here!

Down and out?

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Denying-History » Thu Mar 02, 2017 2:25 pm

What happened to leaving?
« Oral history is a complex field. After all, memory can be a distorting mirror, as anyone who has ever worked with memoir literature knows very well...They may be imperfect, and, at times, inaccurate as the narrator tries to cast himself in the most favorable light, but all sources are imperfect. Even an archival document reflects how the person who drafted it understood something and remains something less than the unvarnished truth. »
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Denying-History » Thu Mar 02, 2017 2:30 pm

If we follow the orthodox Holocaust narrative, the so-called Aktion Reinhardt Camps – Bełżec, Sobibór and Treblinka – were pure extermination camps. In the very lethal sense of the word, they are said to have been dead ends for Jewish deportees sent there, who were allegedly murdered in homicidal gas chambers using engine-exhaust gas, and their corpses subsequently buried and later exhumed and cremated on huge outdoor pyres.
This is inaccurate, it does not mean that Action Reinhardt was purely for murder, in small cases selections happened at the camps. This is the case for Jules Schelvis. It does not mean these sites were transit centers and does not find the missing 713,000 people from 1942.
« Oral history is a complex field. After all, memory can be a distorting mirror, as anyone who has ever worked with memoir literature knows very well...They may be imperfect, and, at times, inaccurate as the narrator tries to cast himself in the most favorable light, but all sources are imperfect. Even an archival document reflects how the person who drafted it understood something and remains something less than the unvarnished truth. »
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 3:05 pm

"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Thu Mar 02, 2017 3:17 pm


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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Aaron Richards » Thu Mar 02, 2017 5:14 pm

Wasnt Minna Grossova transited from Treblinka to the West (Auschwitz)? That doesnt answer the HC team's challenge, and therefore no shekels for Carlo Mattogno, I am afraid :lol:

Reading further, perhaps this is the quote Monstrous is most happy about:

Siegmund Rothstein, born in 1867, who was first deported to the Theresienstadt Ghetto for elderly Jews in August 1942. Barely a month later, however, on September 26, he was deported to Treblinka at the age of 75. But that was not his end at all, because the German authorities found life signs of him further east, as they finally determined that Rothstein died in Minsk, the capital city of Belarus, some 240 miles (286 km) east of Treblinka. I doubt 75-year-old Mr. Rothstein jumped off the train prior to arriving at Treblinka and ran all the way to German-occupied Minsk, Hence, he must have traveled there by train. I also doubt that the German authorities reserved a train just for him or put just him on a military train going to Minsk. Rather, he must have made that journey on a deportation train together with hundreds or thousands of fellow deportees from Theresienstadt.
Boisdefeu states that none of the thousands of Jews deported from Theresienstadt is listed in the German memorial book as having been killed at Treblinka, but that they all are listed with a variety of different locations where they either died or were last heard of and then went missing.
This case, too, indicates that thousands of Jews seem to have been deported to “the East” with Treblinka as a transit station.
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 5:59 pm

Not very impressed with Boisdefu's piece. On this particular individual, Boisdefu is more thorough at least than what has been quoted above - but he is not honest:
. . . still more interesting is the journey taken by this deportee that is described in the database. Rothstein, born in 1867, was 75 years of age when he was deported from Berlin to Theresienstadt in August 1942, which means that he could only be deemed unfit for work and therefore, according to official historiography, had to be sent to the gas chamber; in this case, why was he sent to Theresienstadt? This is one of the many mysteries of the Holocaust religion, but let’s move on. From there, he was deported again to Treblinka on September 26, 1942 (transport Br), where, according to the historians, he was gassed at arrival. The editors of the Czech entry consequently go no further: for them, as well, Rothstein died at Treblinka.

However, when the German entry mentions the death of Rothstein, it places it much further east, in Belarus—in Minsk to be precise!

Yad Vashem has three entries for Rothstein, two of them giving his place of death as Minsk. I don't know why the discrepancy, and neither the item above nor Boisdefu explains it. Which is a flimsy reed indeed on which to perch the resettlement claim.

We don't know for sure where Rothstein died - nor if it were in Minsk exactly how he arrived there. So the data on Rothstein is inconclusive.

The dishonest part of the Boisdefu's text is this, a typical example of denier black/white strawmannirg:
75 years of age when he was deported from Berlin to Theresienstadt in August 1942, which means that he could only be deemed unfit for work and therefore, according to official historiography, had to be sent to the gas chamber; in this case, why was he sent to Theresienstadt? This is one of the many mysteries of the Holocaust religion

Heydrich at Wannsee described Theresienstadt like this:
An important precondition, SS Obergruppenfuehrer Heydrich noted further, for the carrying out of the evacuation in general is the precise determination of the groups of persons involved. It is intended not to evacuate Jews over 65 years old, but to place them in an old-age ghetto — Theresienstadt is being considered.

In addition to these age groups — about 30% of the 280,000 Jews who were present in the Altreich and the Ostmark on October 31, 1941, were over 65 years old Jews with severe war injuries and Jews with war decorations (Iron Cross, First Class) will be admitted to the Jewish old-age ghetto. This suitable solution will eliminate at one blow the many applications for exceptions.

That many elderly Reich Jews, along with decorated Jews and Jews who were wounded veterans, were taken to Theresienstadt is not news to the high priests of the Holocaust religion, er, historians. Nor is it news that transports from Theresienstadt carried Jews to Auschwitz and other extermination centers. Historians know too that famous or prominent Jews, whom the Nazis thought suitable for exchanges of prisoners with the Allies, were also housed at Theresienstadt. What's a supposed "mystery" according to Boisdefu is actually common knowledge.

As to the transports from "the old-age ghetto" to the East, Jews would be culled from Theresienstadt and deported to Riga, Izbica, Piaski, Warsaw, Minsk (Maly Trostinets), and various ghettos in Poland; then, with Einsatz Reinhard in full fury, transports from Theresienstadt were directed to Treblinka starting in September and to Birkenau in late October and for months thereafter. Of the nearly 150,000 Jews who were sent to Theresienstadt during its existence, about 33,000 were to die there and almost 90,000 were sent on “to the East,” nearly 75,000 to their deaths, mostly in Auschwitz and Treblinka.

In keeping with the role of Theresienstadt, to provide partial cover for the genocide and to be useful for propaganda (what sense would it make to Germans that 75-year-olds were taken to the East for labor?), the Eichmann trial court observed that
Exhibit T/734 is a report of a consultation on 6 March 1942 in Section IVB4 of the RSHA, presided over by the Accused [Eichmann], when he himself explained that the transports to Terezin were made in order to "keep up appearances for the outside world." In exhibit T/537 (memorandum by Zoepf on a conversation he had with the Accused), Terezin is described simply as the "propaganda camp." 

Already in late fall 1941 Heydrich was looking forward to the way in which internees at Theresidenstadt would be dealt with (T/294):
After further deportations to the East from this temporary camp, in which the Jews will in any case be heavily decimated, the whole area will be built up and developed into an exemplary German settlement.

Later Eichmann was to preside over a police chiefs’ meeting where he told the officials (T/734) that
for the sake of placating the elderly people they should be told that they would be moved in the course of the summer or autumn to Theresienstadt, which was earmarked as the ghetto for the aged. This is being done as a face-saving device for the outside.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 7:06 pm

Biographical information on Rothstein in some online databases, including one of the three at Yad Vashem, has him transported to Theresienstadt on 4 August 1942 and then from Theresienstadt to Treblinka on 26 September 1942.

Yad Vashem has a list of deportees on the 26 September transport to Treblinka - I will look again in a bit, as some of the names are out of alphabetical order and the list is slow loading, but on two clicks through the list I didn't see Rothstein's name. Nor was his name on deportee lists for transports from Theresienstadt to Minsk or Maly Trustiness around this time - again, slow loading lists, some jumbled names. I didn't search all the transports to Treblinka from Theresienstadt.

As of now I cannot say when Rothstein left Theresienstadt or where he went to. I doubt our denier friends can say, either.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:04 pm

Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Image
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 10:27 pm

Guess who started a new thread to divert from his failures in the Auschwitz thread and others?
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Thu Mar 02, 2017 10:48 pm

Following up on my points above about how Boisdefu failed to clarify Siegmund Rothstein’s itinerary, here Rothstein’s deportation to Theresienstadt is given as 4 August 1942. And his deportation from Theresienstadt to Treblinka is given as 26 September 1942.

Image

But here is detail for “Transport Br from Theresienstadt, Ghetto, Czechoslovakia to Treblinka, Extermination Camp, Poland on 26/09/1942” - that is, Rothstein’s likely transport. His name is not listed among the 1000 deportees (unless it is out of alphabetical order . . . ).

It isn’t clear where Rothstein was deported to or when - or that the contradictory database entries on him are fully accurate.

another biographical webpage on Rothstein, giving his death as occurring at Treblinka, same key dates as above

And I am plumb out of energy for searching further right now . . . maybe later.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Im_Not_Creative_Enough » Fri Mar 03, 2017 9:48 am

Monstrous, get that eggplant out of your nose for god's sake.
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:21 pm

I've looked through the passenger lists for I/37 (Berlin to Theresienstadt, 4 August 1942) and all transports from Theresienstadt to Minsk/May Trostinets (5 transports, the lists appear complete), and the 26 September 1942 transport from Theresienstadt to Treblinka - as well as two additional transports to Treblinka (see below).

Siegmund Rothstein is listed on I/37, which puts him in Theresienstadt in early August 1942. His name appears on none of the Theresienstadt-to-Minsk transports; it does not appear on the 26 September Theresienstadt-to-Treblinka deportee list (1000 names), that is, the transport which some records of his life say took him to Treblinka (these records form the basis for the denier claim that Rothstein is an example of the 1000s "transited through" Treblinka to the East).

This means that, using the sources deniers use to "get Rothstein to Treblinka," I can't get him there. I don't have an explanation for the conflicting YV and other database biographical entries - nor do the deniers who claim that Rothstein's itinerary proves that the Germans had some sort of eastern resettlement program.

On those conflicting biographical details, YV has him (1) perishing in Treblnka (source: List of Jewish victims from the Memorial book "Victims of the Persecution of Jews under the National Socialist Tyranny in Germany 1933 - 1945" prepared by the German Federal Archives); (2) missing in Minsk (Yizkor book of the Kitzingen community with names and biographic data of Jews who perished during the Holocaust)l and (3) murdered in Minsk (Gedenkbuch Berlins der jüdischen Opfer des Nazionalsozialismus, Freie Universität Berlin, Zentralinstitut für sozialwissenschaftliche Forschung, Edition Hentrich, Berlin 1995 (Memorial Book of the Jewish victims of National Socialism in Berlin, Free Unive . . .). Two of the three YV entires have his deportation to Theresienstadt on 4 August 1942, as above.

We’ve seen that Boisdefu, without stating why, decided that the contradictory biographical information on Siegmund Rothstein proved his transit from Berlin to Theresienstadt to Minsk via Treblinka and thus makes him a representative case for 100s of 1000s of Jews “transited” east. Rudolf, as we’ve seen, relies on these leaps of imagination made by Boisdefu regarding Rothstein. Despite Rothstein’s name not being on the 26 September 1942 Theresienstadt-to-Treblinka deportee list, Rudolf declares it a fact that “as first deported to the Theresienstadt Ghetto for elderly Jews in August 1942. Barely a month later, however, on September 26, he was deported to Treblinka at the age of 75.” Again, no, based on what they themselves have provided, deniers have only contradictory indications of the movements and fate of Rothstein. On this they try hanging a resettlement hat. For 100s of 1000s of Jews from across Europe, in the case of Treblinka.

I haven’t yet gone through all Treblinka transports from Theresienstadt (there were 10) - and don’t know that I will, since I have checked the sources provided to support the denier claims about Rothstein and cannot see where they support the claims. However, I did check the deportee lists for the transports to Treblinka on 23 September 1942 and 29 September 1942, that is, the transports immediately before and after Rothstein’s purported deportation train. Neither lists any deportee with last name “Rothstein.”

To my mind, anyone wishing to prove Rothstein’s whereabouts during 1942 would next need to consult the sources from which the biographical data on Rothstein at YV was compiled, namely, the Yizkor book of the Kitzingen community (not online), Gedenkbuch Berlins … (in USHMM and YV libraries); and Victims … (https://www.bundesarchiv.de/gedenkbuch/ ... frmResults: “Rothstein, Sigmund Siegmund born on 16th January 1867 in Mainstockheim / Kitzingen / Bayern resident of Würzburg and Berlin (Charlottenburg) Deportation: from Berlin 04th August 1942, Theresienstadt, ghetto 26th September 1942, Treblinka, extermination camp”). Judging from the online entry for the last of the three given sources, insufficient detail may be present in any source to specify precisely what happened to Siegmund Rothstein. Searching all the deportation lists with trains sent to Treblinka might also turn up Rothstein, albeit on a transport different to the one used by deniers to prove their claim.

In any event, Minsk was not a “good” destination for Reich Jews - hardly a resettlement location in the denier sense. During this period the Germans were murdering Jews in Minsk and by 1943 liquidated the ghetto, deporting its inhabitants as discussed in the "Arad's Goof" thread (e.g., Heinz Rosenberg and Sasha Pechersky transported to Sobibór).

I thank Monstrous in advance for clearing this up for us. It is definitely possible that somehow in checking lists with several thousand names, some out of alphabetical order, I missed "Siegmund Rothstein." In any event, if they wish to convince anyone using the example of Rothstein, deniers need to account for the discrepant information which they've relied on thus far and clear up what actually became of him.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:51 pm

Another fact to consider - The average age of the Theresinstadt deportees was 65-75. Having looked rather extensively at the history of the Minsk Ghetto, I cannot recall any mention being made of masses of elderly German Jews arriving there.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:41 pm

I've now searched all 10 transports from Theresienstadt to Treblinka without finding Siegmund Rothstein on any of the deportee lists.

Siegmund was transported from Berlin to Theresienstadt. Other members of his family were deported from his hometown, Mainstockheim / Kitzingen, at least 2 brothers to Theresienstadt (Rudolf, Heinrich) where their deaths were recorded and a niece (Antonie) and nephew (Siegfried) to Izbica (later officially declared dead there, more likely having been murdered in Sobibór or Bełzec). I also searched 1942 transport from Theresienstadt to Auschwitz, not finding Rothstein's name.

Interestingly, JewishGen for Würzburg concludes simply that Siegmund Rothstein was "Deported, destination unknown."
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Aaron Richards » Fri Mar 03, 2017 10:22 pm

Now if Rudolf ever lurked on this forum I'd hope to see this thread wipe the smirk off his face. Excellent job, Statistical Mechanic.
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:33 pm

Thanks to a PM (you know who you are - and thank you!) I now have 4 Yad Vashem records on Siegmund Rothstein - 2 having him deported from Theresienstadt to Minsk, 2 to Treblinka (previously I'd seen just 3 - 2 for Minsk, 1 for Treblinka).

Also, I neglected to mention that one of the records has Siegmund transported to Theresienstadt from Mainstockheim,Kitzingen, his childhood home, not Berlin where he lived and where other Yad Vashem records, including a deportation list (I/37), have him being deported from. Siegmund's nephew, Siegfried, and 3 other relatives were taken from Mainstockheim,Kitzingen (sent to Izbica and Theresienstadt).

Flimsy foundation to build a resettlement theory, or any certain account, so far . . .
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Monstrous » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:44 pm

If SM thinks he has managed to find a point, then SM could crawl out from the "Skeptic" rock he has been hiding under and crawl over to CODOH and humbly ask for a review!

Of course, this will not happen, because then SM would be subjected to a ghastly SMashdown as the Believer beliefs are picked apart and horrendously squashed!
Last edited by Monstrous on Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:49 pm

Monstrous wrote:If SM thinks he has managed to find a point, then SM could crawl out from the "Skeptic" rock he has been hiding under and crawl over to CODOH and humbly ask for a review!

Of course, this will not happen, because then SM would be subjected to a ghastly SMashdown as the Believer beliefs are picked apart and horrendously squashed!


Silly Monstrous, do you honestly think that CODOH would allow someone like Stat Mech to join?

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Darren Wilshak » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:51 pm

Hyperbole is not argument. Codoh does not have free and open debate and is run by a pair or more of liars. Does anyone need to humble themselves to Rudolf or Hargis say - apart from fawning Neo Nazi masochists?
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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Darren Wilshak » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:54 pm

He reads metapedia and codoh.

Well now it makes sense.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Xcalibur » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:16 pm

Monstrous wrote:If SM thinks he has managed to find a point, then SM could crawl out from the "Skeptic" rock he has been hiding under and crawl over to CODOH and humbly ask for a review!

Of course, this will not happen, because then SM would be subjected to a ghastly SMashdown as the Believer beliefs are picked apart and horrendously squashed!



"Smashdown" by who at Codoh exactly? Go on, pick one.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:18 pm

Darren Wilshak wrote:He reads metapedia and codoh.

Well now it makes sense.



He also reads the Holocaust Handbooks. Well, at least I think so, he only links to adverts for them.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:18 pm

Monstrous wrote:If SM thinks he has managed to find a point, then SM could crawl out from the "Skeptic" rock he has been hiding under and crawl over to CODOH and humbly ask for a review!

Why on earth would I go over to Codoh, the Stalinist sewer of HD? The readership there is tiny and inbred. We get many visitors here, actually. How about you try to defend the Siegmund Rothstein gambit? You're the one who posted it here - now you want to try hiding behind the nitwits at Codoh? LOL.

So a question for you: are you going to defend the crap you posted - or are you going to rest at trying to make lame insults?
Monstrous wrote:Of course, this will not happen, because then SM would be subjected to a ghastly SMashdown as the Believer beliefs are picked apart and horrendously squashed!

I haven't posted a single thing about beliefs, as you know. I've posted about the source material behind the insupportable (so far) argument in your link.

I take this post of yours to be your half-assed acknowledgement that you have nothing to clarify or support the case you tried making. And as a symptom of your frustration with yourself for never getting anywhere with anything you try here.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Mar 05, 2017 1:37 pm

Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Aaron Richards » Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:47 pm

Monstrous needs to realize RODOH is the arena. RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out and throw facts and factoids at each other. CODOH is a heavily moderated virtual college campus safe space for deniers; it is Hargis, Hermod, Hektor and Borjastick's echo chamber and containment board. Why do you think it only has half a dozen or so active members gather every morning to kvetch over the latest story about zionism in a newspaper article while RODOH has around 30 members hotly debating various topics of the holocaust?

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"...we had the duty towards our Volk (the German people) to kill this Volk (the Jewish people) that wanted to kill us." - Himmler in his 1943 Posen speech reminding any future holocaust denier how absurd their beliefs really are.
I compile rebuttals to popular holocaust denier canards here: http://imgur.com/a/725A7

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Mar 05, 2017 7:51 pm

Aaron Richards wrote:... RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out ....

Used to hang out, as of 5 or so years ago ... now it is mostly Nessie flinging poo with AryanScholar, k0nsl, Fish-Traynor-Hazard, SS, Berg, Werd, Gerdes, Turnagain, Bob, and been-there. No heavy hitters there on any regular basis.

Occasionally Hans or Andy Mathis might show up ... and a few others ... but overall it's very low-level. How many posts on corpse color does the world need, or Werd's CTs or Gerdes' yes/no lists?

Well, Duke is still there. They're lucky to have him, although they don't realize that ...
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 8:34 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Aaron Richards wrote:... RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out ....

Used to hang out, as of 5 or so years ago ... now it is mostly Nessie flinging poo with AryanScholar, k0nsl, Fish-Traynor-Hazard, SS, Berg, Werd, Gerdes, Turnagain, Bob, and been-there. No heavy hitters there on any regular basis.

Occasionally Hans or Andy Mathis might show up ... and a few others ... but overall it's very low-level. How many posts on corpse color does the world need, or Werd's CTs or Gerdes' yes/no lists?

Well, Duke is still there. They're lucky to have him, although they don't realize that ...


It's essentially an echo chamber for deniers.

As for big boys, I guess Berg qualifies because he is fairly well known, Hunt as well (even though he's switched sides).
BROI posts on occasion and he posts everywhere (though like Hunt he switched sides).

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Mar 05, 2017 9:59 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Aaron Richards wrote:... RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out ....

Used to hang out, as of 5 or so years ago ... now it is mostly Nessie flinging poo with AryanScholar, k0nsl, Fish-Traynor-Hazard, SS, Berg, Werd, Gerdes, Turnagain, Bob, and been-there. No heavy hitters there on any regular basis.

Occasionally Hans or Andy Mathis might show up ... and a few others ... but overall it's very low-level. How many posts on corpse color does the world need, or Werd's CTs or Gerdes' yes/no lists?

Well, Duke is still there. They're lucky to have him, although they don't realize that ...


It's essentially an echo chamber for deniers.

As for big boys, I guess Berg qualifies because he is fairly well known, Hunt as well (even though he's switched sides).
BROI posts on occasion and he posts everywhere (though like Hunt he switched sides).

But when I think of the denier gurus, well, I don't consider Berg among them, actually. Mattogno yes, Rudolf check, Graf check, "Dalton" a name maybe but not a guru, Reynouard maybe, (Kues and Jannson have disappeared . . . ) - even Rucker, Alvarez or Grubach would be closer to one of the "big names," but there are not many I guess. Rodoh is really what Nick Terry used to call a handful of cheerleaders (like Berg) and a lot of trolls and chimps.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:24 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Aaron Richards wrote:... RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out ....

Used to hang out, as of 5 or so years ago ... now it is mostly Nessie flinging poo with AryanScholar, k0nsl, Fish-Traynor-Hazard, SS, Berg, Werd, Gerdes, Turnagain, Bob, and been-there. No heavy hitters there on any regular basis.

Occasionally Hans or Andy Mathis might show up ... and a few others ... but overall it's very low-level. How many posts on corpse color does the world need, or Werd's CTs or Gerdes' yes/no lists?

Well, Duke is still there. They're lucky to have him, although they don't realize that ...


It's essentially an echo chamber for deniers.

As for big boys, I guess Berg qualifies because he is fairly well known, Hunt as well (even though he's switched sides).
BROI posts on occasion and he posts everywhere (though like Hunt he switched sides).

But when I think of the denier gurus, well, I don't consider Berg among them, actually. Mattogno yes, Rudolf check, Graf check, "Dalton" a name maybe but not a guru, Reynouard maybe, (Kues and Jannson have disappeared . . . ) - even Rucker, Alvarez or Grubach would be closer to one of the "big names," but there are not many I guess. Rodoh is really what Nick Terry used to call a handful of cheerleaders (like Berg) and a lot of trolls and chimps.


Maybe Berg is not a "guru" per se but definitely a name recognized by those who study this. I agree with Mattogno, Graf and Reynouard, I'd add Faurrison as a guru. The rest I agree with.

I'd say Berg pioneered the diesel argument, along with corpse color. His arguments are used extensively by other deniers in disputing the ARC along with the symptoms of cyanide poisoning and how those corpses would look.

Berg is also very much the stereotype of what people would think of as a Holocaust denier with his slimy antisemitism and his ass-kissing Hitler worship.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:30 pm

Going back some years, Nick Terry (I just checked) had Faurisson and Grubach as cheerleaders, past there sell-by dates. He didn't even mention Berg LOL. It's kind of devils dancing on pinheads, no? By any standard, Rodoh is the echo chamber (and conspiraloon gathering place) you describe it to be.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:39 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Going back some years, Nick Terry (I just checked) had Faurisson and Grubach as cheerleaders, past there sell-by dates. He didn't even mention Berg LOL. It's kind of devils dancing on pinheads, no? By any standard, Rodoh is the echo chamber (and conspiraloon gathering place) you describe it to be.


Oh, I agree they are past their sell-by dates. Really the ones like Faurrison, etc., are dinosaurs.

The time for the "researchers" like Graf and Mattogno is running out. They pump out books but who else besides them (and Rudolf) is doing this?

As Dr. Terry says, the YouTube deniers and bloggers are rising to the forefront. They don't care about "research," they regurgitate all the old goofy canards that Nizkor demolished in the 90's. They can get away with this because most people don't read Cesarani or Gerlach.

I haven't checked RODOH in the last couple of days. It's a waste, I don't want to get sucked into an argument over dirt piles and pressure buildup inside gas chambers.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:22 am

Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeff_36 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:28 am

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Aaron Richards wrote:... RODOH is where all the big boys from both sides hang out ....

Used to hang out, as of 5 or so years ago ... now it is mostly Nessie flinging poo with AryanScholar, k0nsl, Fish-Traynor-Hazard, SS, Berg, Werd, Gerdes, Turnagain, Bob, and been-there. No heavy hitters there on any regular basis.

Occasionally Hans or Andy Mathis might show up ... and a few others ... but overall it's very low-level. How many posts on corpse color does the world need, or Werd's CTs or Gerdes' yes/no lists?

Well, Duke is still there. They're lucky to have him, although they don't realize that ...


It's essentially an echo chamber for deniers.

As for big boys, I guess Berg qualifies because he is fairly well known, Hunt as well (even though he's switched sides).
BROI posts on occasion and he posts everywhere (though like Hunt he switched sides).


I agree. RODOH, IMO is more of an echo chamber than CODOH, or at least it was until Hunt, BROI and Blake switched sides.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:32 am

Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:36 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?



He's digging through CODOH right now trying to find an answer.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Jeff_36 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:11 am

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?



He's digging through CODOH right now trying to find an answer.


I don't see him on my thread ether.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Xcalibur » Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:00 am

Jeff_36 wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Did I miss the post where Monstrous proved that Siegmund Rothstein went to Minsk from Theresienstadt by way of Treblinka?



He's digging through CODOH right now trying to find an answer.


Which is not a rely..

Spamming that horseshit is a dodge.Everyone here has already read it over the years and each has good reason to find it garbage.

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:06 pm

Monstrous, prove what route Siegmund Rothstein went by to which final destination, then - if you can get him to Minsk - prove that this same route was taken by 10s or 100s of 1000s of others - and then prove that Minsk a resettlement (or transit) destination . . . the ball is in your court.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927

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Re: Scott & Rudolf: Monstrous Tag-Team Believer Takedown!

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Mon Mar 06, 2017 2:19 pm

The fate of Siegmund R cannot be solved using the sources cited by Rudolf, Boisdefu or Monstrous. This means that they are talking out their asses in making claims about his fate.

Another possibility to consider is that Siegmund R perished in Theresienstadt. Speculating out of school a bit, I doubt this to some extent, because we have four albeit not-so-hot reports, sourced to memorial type books and federal records based on memorial type books, that have him departing the camp in the same general direction - Treblinka-Siedlce-Minsk. But memorial books are neither source documents nor careful secondary analysis . . .

The complication of course is that Siegmund R's name is found only on the passenger manifest for I/37 bringing him to Theresienstadt but not on any of the lists for transports leaving Theresienstadt for Minsk, Maly Trostinets or Treblinka.

This raises yet another possibility namely that Siegmund R was taken to Izbica or another place. Still, if no manifest for a transport leaving Theresienstadt with Siegmund Rothstein's name is found, there's a real possibility of his death having occurred in Theresienstadt.

But in fact this is what Monstrous (and Rudolf) should have figured out before claiming Siegmund R to be an example of 100s of 1000s of Jews passing through Treblinka to be shot somewhere further east.
Last edited by Statistical Mechanic on Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"World peace is certainly an ideal worth striving for; in Hitler's opinion it will be realizable only when one power, the racially best one, has attained complete and uncontested supremacy. That can then provide a sort of world police, seeing to it at the same time that the most valuable race is guaranteed the necessary living space. And if no other way is open to them, the lower races will have to restrict themselves accordingly."

- Rudolf Hess, letter, 1927


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