The dumbest denier of all time

Holocaust denial and related subjects.
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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:32 am

>> I'll agree with you on the Rizolis, but neither of the brothers holds a candle to Clayton Moore.

Few, if any, can.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby nickterry » Fri Aug 04, 2017 12:02 pm

In retrospect, CM was a harbinger of the Trumpocalypse.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 12:25 pm

nickterry wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Monstrous doesn't even make the top 15.


I base my rating on how ridiculous the claims and how ignorant of history the denier is. I also rate this on my interaction with them, I can't rate someone I haven't dealt with personally.


Others have interacted with your picks and can compare them to deniers you've not encountered. Moreover, the stupidity is recorded in most cases - Clayton Moore's imbecility makes up a big chunk of the ISF/JREF threads (part 1 and especially part 2). We can all observe the stupidities at CODOH forum, if someone wanted to make a case for a scrapbookpages denier in the comments threads there then these can be linked. Ditto with YouTube and Twitter deniers.

Besides, your rankings are skewed even for those deniers we all know. Hargis is undoubtedly more stupid than k0nsl, but k0nsl doesn't really debate the details of the Holocaust. Werd may be deranged due to the fact that he has never met a conspiracy theory he doesn't like, but he, too, comes across as more intelligent than Hannover. Your list omits David, who strikes me as far more infantile, ignorant and unable to express himself than Werd. I'll agree with you on the Rizolis, but neither of the brothers holds a candle to Clayton Moore.


This isn't really based on some sort of scientific formula. I made a lot of my list with tongue planted firmly in cheek, along with a gut feel. I left David off because he's vanished from the board. Saggy made the list because I've now started dealing with him.

I agree with you on k0nsl, to me he's just the IT monkey that makes stupid comments about Jews.

I leave off social media deniers, to me they aren't worth that much energy unless they show up here. There is an oddball named Dannl Yoder who argued with me over at writers beat that the Holocaust didn't happen because God wouldn't allow it. He also told me that if it did happen then the Jews deserved it.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 12:45 pm

Another way to look at the question is to ask, over time, which deniers' arguments/cases have done the most harm to their cause.

Clayton Moore's ability to bring nearly everyone together in astonishment - as Saggy has done, too, and still does - ranks high. I think that's why Clayton always emerges on top. Berg's Stundie is a reminder of his noxious idiocy and repellant factor. David's inability to be remotely coherent propels him upward on any such listing. Posters like Ephraimite, on the one hand, or davecatlicense, on the other, have few rivals; in this regard it is sad that pooshoodog destroyed Rodoh as so much material is lost . . .
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:04 pm

@Sergey: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... count=2914

I began a reply to Saggy with a number of links to your HC pieces on SK-1005 and this remark: "Some basic information on SK-1005 is found in these links (Sergey Romanov at HC, if you have questions, I will be glad to ask Sergey."
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:23 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Another way to look at the question is to ask, over time, which deniers' arguments/cases have done the most harm to their cause.

Clayton Moore's ability to bring nearly everyone together in astonishment - as Saggy has done, too, and still does - ranks high. I think that's why Clayton always emerges on top. Berg's Stundie is a reminder of his noxious idiocy and repellant factor. David's inability to be remotely coherent propels him upward on any such listing. Posters like Ephraimite, on the one hand, or davecatlicense, on the other, have few rivals; in this regard it is sad that pooshoodog destroyed Rodoh as so much material is lost . . .


I actually rate Monstrous high on the jaw-dropping, astonishing, mind-blowing stupidity he displayed with some of his comments. It's why I listed him at the top. It's also why I rate the flying Rizoli brothers so high.

Anyway, our lists are subjective. I keep hermie on my list because he's such an antisemitic moron that he deserves his spot. I've made the decision to keep Berg and Yeager there for the same reason.

Saggy is going to shoot straight to the top with a bullet if he keeps it up.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:39 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Another way to look at the question is to ask, over time, which deniers' arguments/cases have done the most harm to their cause.

Clayton Moore's ability to bring nearly everyone together in astonishment - as Saggy has done, too, and still does - ranks high. I think that's why Clayton always emerges on top. Berg's Stundie is a reminder of his noxious idiocy and repellant factor. David's inability to be remotely coherent propels him upward on any such listing. Posters like Ephraimite, on the one hand, or davecatlicense, on the other, have few rivals; in this regard it is sad that pooshoodog destroyed Rodoh as so much material is lost . . .


I actually rate Monstrous high on the jaw-dropping, astonishing, mind-blowing stupidity he displayed with some of his comments.

Seriously, for loopy, mind-being nonsense, you need to read Steve Wiseman, ralphgordon, Ephraimite, davecatlicense, 666ismoney, or others. Monstrous is really typical in almost every way, a useless nonentity. But I know I will never convince you . . . :)
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:48 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:Another way to look at the question is to ask, over time, which deniers' arguments/cases have done the most harm to their cause.

Clayton Moore's ability to bring nearly everyone together in astonishment - as Saggy has done, too, and still does - ranks high. I think that's why Clayton always emerges on top. Berg's Stundie is a reminder of his noxious idiocy and repellant factor. David's inability to be remotely coherent propels him upward on any such listing. Posters like Ephraimite, on the one hand, or davecatlicense, on the other, have few rivals; in this regard it is sad that pooshoodog destroyed Rodoh as so much material is lost . . .


I actually rate Monstrous high on the jaw-dropping, astonishing, mind-blowing stupidity he displayed with some of his comments.

Seriously, for loopy, mind-being nonsense, you need to read Steve Wiseman, ralphgordon, Ephraimite, davecatlicense, 666ismoney, or others. Monstrous is really typical in almost every way, a useless nonentity. But I know I will never convince you . . . :)


666ismoney is a complete whackadoodle that seriously needs to be placed somewhere quiet so that she can bundle herself up in a warm blanket, a cup of herbal tea and a tin foil hat.

:lol:

I guess I need to go through some of the old RODOH stuff.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:05 pm

Mind-being? Mind-bending! LOL

But you can't, because pooshoodog destroyed Rodoh. I have to say, the crowd included stone-dumb deniers, the most wigged-out nutcase imaginable, and all the unpleasant self-importance and arrogance of a BROI, though it was before his time. It was pretty much a madhouse. Just my opinion. Rodoh666 didn't match the bad craziness.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:15 pm

That's too bad.

I may have to redo my list. Again.

Saggy is going to climb the charts.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 5:11 pm

Saggy admits he doesn't know anything about the material he posts! http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... count=2935

He goes on to denounce all testimonies in various Black Books as lies - without having read any of them - or even having known about them! His "escape" is "I didn't know where this came from but the books are all self-evidently nothing but lies."

What a {!#%@}.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 5:16 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Saggy admits he doesn't know anything about the material he posts! http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... count=2935

He goes on to denounce all testimonies in various Black Books as lies - without having read any of them - or even having known about them! His "escape" is "I didn't know where this came from but the books are all self-evidently nothing but lies."

What a {!#%@}.



Yeah, he got the authors wrong but it's immaterial.

:lol:

I also noticed he doesn't want to talk about the "Jew led" NKVD anymore. I guess he couldn't find a good quote mine.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Im_Not_Creative_Enough » Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:28 pm

I recently watched a series of vidoes about US army training. One of the episodes showed how the recruits are forced to endure a couple of minutes in a (tear) gas chamber.

The third highest rated comment was "oy vey remember the 6 trillion".

F*** my life.
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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:38 pm

nickterry wrote: Hargis is undoubtedly more stupid than k0nsl, but k0nsl doesn't really debate the details of the Holocaust.


K0nsl's take on the Avraham Tory diary (you were part of that debate) was so outrageously stupid that I was literally screaming laughing and hollering like a madman when I read it. He literally could not understand evidence that had been presented to his face and explained multiple times. Hargis is more willfully ignorant but that one little spectacle put K0nsl over the top for me.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:45 pm

nickterry wrote:In retrospect, CM was a harbinger of the Trumpocalypse.


Indeed. The subordination of truth to opinion, universal in deniers, is also common in Trumplets.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:47 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Saggy admits he doesn't know anything about the material he posts! http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... count=2935

He goes on to denounce all testimonies in various Black Books as lies - without having read any of them - or even having known about them! His "escape" is "I didn't know where this came from but the books are all self-evidently nothing but lies."

What a {!#%@}.


Saggy is climbing my list rapidly. However he is far too boring and repetitive to truly raise eyebrows. I suppose my list is skewed towards deniers that I have encountered personally.

It's always "lies, lies, absurd lies, ridiculous, insane lies, more lies" blaaaah blaaaaah blaaaaaah.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:15 pm

and on that note: Why isn't saggy responding to LeoMajor's posts??!?!?!?

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:24 pm

for the same reason he doesn't respond to anyone else's posts?
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:01 pm

Looks like International Skeptics is having an issue, can't log on. Keep getting a message of "Bad Gateway."

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:43 pm

Never mind, back on.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:23 pm

oh there's an issue there all right, and it's name is Saggy
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Balmoral95 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:35 pm

Jesus wept, Ralph Gordon... RODOH's staff paranoid, lmao.

Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...
Last edited by Balmoral95 on Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:37 pm

LOL
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:40 pm

LOL
Well, at least it gives us something to do other than talk about Trump.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Balmoral95 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:50 pm

Jeffk 1970 wrote:LOL
Well, at least it gives us something to do other than talk about Trump.


Interesting you should bring that up as Ralph and Trump share many of the same pathologies :lol:

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:58 am

Balmoral95 wrote:Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...


To be fair I would do the same if I were to post at RODOH. I frankly don't trust their mods even a little bit.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:59 am

Balmoral95 wrote:
Jeffk 1970 wrote:LOL
Well, at least it gives us something to do other than talk about Trump.


Interesting you should bring that up as Ralph and Trump share many of the same pathologies :lol:


Word salads are the number one similarity..........

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:13 am

Jeff_36 wrote:
Balmoral95 wrote:Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...


To be fair I would do the same if I were to post at RODOH. I frankly don't trust their mods even a little bit.

You're thinking of Rodoh666 and mods like BROI. Nick Terry and the NKVD mod along with SS moderated Rodoh1.0, maybe others, but they were great and, contra ralphie and LGR, there were not shenanigans.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:15 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Jeff_36 wrote:
Balmoral95 wrote:Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...


To be fair I would do the same if I were to post at RODOH. I frankly don't trust their mods even a little bit.

You're thinking of Rodoh666 and mods like BROI. Nick Terry and the NKVD mod along with SS moderated Rodoh1.0, maybe others, but they were great and, contra ralphie and LGR, there were not shenanigans.


RG comes across as legitimately mentally ill/paranoid.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Balmoral95 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:29 am

Jeff_36 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Jeff_36 wrote:
Balmoral95 wrote:Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...


To be fair I would do the same if I were to post at RODOH. I frankly don't trust their mods even a little bit.

You're thinking of Rodoh666 and mods like BROI. Nick Terry and the NKVD mod along with SS moderated Rodoh1.0, maybe others, but they were great and, contra ralphie and LGR, there were not shenanigans.


RG comes across as legitimately mentally ill/paranoid.


He and been_there should share a room in a facility.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:50 am

Jeff_36 wrote:
Statistical Mechanic wrote:
Jeff_36 wrote:
Balmoral95 wrote:Ah, sweet memories: back in 2003 he thought that me and Dr. Mathis were bona fide Mossad infiltrators... spent his time driving from one public computer to another in Australia so as to avoid "detection"...


To be fair I would do the same if I were to post at RODOH. I frankly don't trust their mods even a little bit.

You're thinking of Rodoh666 and mods like BROI. Nick Terry and the NKVD mod along with SS moderated Rodoh1.0, maybe others, but they were great and, contra ralphie and LGR, there were not shenanigans.


RG comes across as legitimately mentally ill/paranoid.

Just ralphie?
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Aug 06, 2017 2:07 am

ISF needs a mercy rule.

I am surprised that LeoMajor hasn't drawn a warning or even a yellow card. I wonder if I'm on the edge of getting one myself . . .
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Aug 06, 2017 2:48 am

Saggy's new standard for scholars everywhere: "There is no sense trying to refute something that cannot even be googled."

This doesn't quite take the cake, though; that which he was whinging about being ungoogle-able . . . was of course searchable and findable within about 15 seconds (type into bar, click three results, read) on Google.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:14 am

Statistical Mechanic wrote:
I am surprised that LeoMajor hasn't drawn a warning or even a yellow card. I wonder if I'm on the edge of getting one myself . . .


I dont know the guy but it seems that Leo is losing patience with saggy. He is apparently using creatuve spelling to escape the censors.......

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:37 pm

Deniers like Saggy want to jump around, change the subject, throw in distractors, and generally avoid a deep discussion of anything. We saw Monstrous behave much the same way here. Unfortunately for the debate at ISF, the forum's structure - all Holocaust-related topics may be discussed only in the single, long, multi-topic thread - plays right into deniers' hands. It's hard enough to dig into an issue with deniers like Saggy and Monstrous; at ISF, any topic that's introduced is almost at once eviscerated in a blizzard of both well-intentioned and evil posts that pursue other matters. This helps Saggy duck for cover, play hide and seek, muck up efforts at sustained conversation, and dodge whatever he doesn't want to deal with.
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:38 pm

I loath the format but saggy is the only thing going right now.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:49 pm

I was trying to think of a way to make him focus on a theme, but, given the way that forum is, I cannot come up with one. It would require everyone to agree to post only about that topic, I guess. But it also doesn't matter, as he'd squirm around and evade and twist away, as mush as Monstrous did here, even in a more conducive structure. OTOH Monstrous did stick with the EGs, Posen, and a few other topics . . .
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeffk 1970 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:07 pm

Saggy's main source seems to be http://www.holohoax101.org/. I get a big kick out of it, it's not as funny as whale but it's up there.

My favorite denier meme is the Holocausts of yore.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Jeff_36 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:06 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Deniers like Saggy want to jump around, change the subject, throw in distractors, and generally avoid a deep discussion of anything. We saw Monstrous behave much the same way here. Unfortunately for the debate at ISF, the forum's structure - all Holocaust-related topics may be discussed only in the single, long, multi-topic thread - plays right into deniers' hands. It's hard enough to dig into an issue with deniers like Saggy and Monstrous; at ISF, any topic that's introduced is almost at once eviscerated in a blizzard of both well-intentioned and evil posts that pursue other matters. This helps Saggy duck for cover, play hide and seek, muck up efforts at sustained conversation, and dodge whatever he doesn't want to deal with.


That's not an issue - nothing's more fun than a good chase in my opinion.

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Re: The dumbest denier of all time

Postby Statistical Mechanic » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:58 pm

bores me to tears, I prefer clubbing away on a topic, which is why the group at JREF tried gas vans at one point
. . . I mean Negative Capability, that is, when a man is capable of being in uncertainties, mysteries, doubts, without any irritable reaching after fact and reason—Coleridge, for instance, would let go by a fine isolated verisimilitude caught from the Penetralium of mystery, from being incapable of remaining content with half-knowledge. - John Keats, 1817


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