Imagine as if this was a dream

What you think about how you think.
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Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby mirror93 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:15 am

But it isn't.
Last edited by mirror93 on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:22 am, edited 9 times in total.

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Postby mirror93 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:23 am

8-)
Last edited by mirror93 on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:23 am, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: All people are utterly unaware

Postby Dimebag » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:54 am

mirror93 wrote:Realizing that NO person is aware of ANYTHING, is equivalent to realizing that they're all just appearances in, and of, what you truly are (Consciousness). It's Consciousness that is aware. And You alone are consciousness itself, there is no other and nothing else. The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts in existence. There is only You. And If you are aware of this sentence, and you know about the dream, then You ALONE are this dream itself.

Okay, this is not a real revelation. What you are describing is the nature of the self being a construct, not an indivisible, changeless, fundamental feature of the universe. Science has been aware of this for some time now, and the concept has been around in Buddhist literature for maybe thousands of years (not totally sure).

Thanks for reminding us.

However, in day to day life, it is useful, if not essential to refer to the general organism which gives rise to your consciousness, and for that reason, we have a constructed self, which allows thought, reflections, and some would argue, awareness. I'm not so sure about the last one, however, obviously, it is a requirement of self awareness.. Which is maybe where that thought comes from. But the usage of the term, I, is necessary for daily life as a human. Therefore, in a sense, the self does exist, however, it is a construction.

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Re: All people are utterly unaware

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:20 am

mirror93 wrote:You don't know that you have a body. You know sensations, sights, taste, hearing, smelling, feeling, emotions, but not a body.
Nope. Other people take measurements that I can review that also indicate I have a body. This is called "science".

It is a strange quirk of dualism cult followers, that they forget other people exist and individuals can cooperate on shared information. (That and the fact I share my gene pool with these other people )
:D

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The opening post is unsure.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:23 am

mirror93 wrote:Last edited by mirror93 on Tue Aug 08, 2017 2:17 pm, edited 6 times in total.


May I suggest you actually work out your deep and meaningful philosophy first.....before posting it on a skeptic forum and then editing it numerous times because you aren't sure what it actually is.

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Re: All people are utterly unaware

Postby mirror93 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:28 am

Dimebag wrote:
mirror93 wrote:Realizing that NO person is aware of ANYTHING, is equivalent to realizing that they're all just appearances in, and of, what you truly are (Consciousness). It's Consciousness that is aware. And You alone are consciousness itself, there is no other and nothing else. The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts in existence. There is only You. And If you are aware of this sentence, and you know about the dream, then You ALONE are this dream itself.

Okay, this is not a real revelation. What you are describing is the nature of the self being a construct, not an indivisible, changeless, fundamental feature of the universe. Science has been aware of this for some time now, and the concept has been around in Buddhist literature for maybe thousands of years (not totally sure).

Thanks for reminding us.

However, in day to day life, it is useful, if not essential to refer to the general organism which gives rise to your consciousness, and for that reason, we have a constructed self, which allows thought, reflections, and some would argue, awareness. I'm not so sure about the last one, however, obviously, it is a requirement of self awareness.. Which is maybe where that thought comes from. But the usage of the term, I, is necessary for daily life as a human. Therefore, in a sense, the self does exist, however, it is a construction.



I love buddhism and non-self doctrine, even tho, I can't prove it, nor I can say this is any more than a religion, my post is philosophical, I like this type of stuff. However, It's important to distinguish utterly unaware (fainting,sleep, dead) from utterly aware (awake and aware of the enviroment and what is happening), my post was more philosophical, just to imagine as if life was a dream....

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Re: The opening post is unsure.

Postby mirror93 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:28 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
mirror93 wrote:Last edited by mirror93 on Tue Aug 08, 2017 2:17 pm, edited 6 times in total.


May I suggest you actually work out your deep and meaningful philosophy first.....before posting it on a skeptic forum and then editing it numerous times because you aren't sure what it actually is.


I change my thinking and ideas every minute, it just comes

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Re: The opening post is unsure.

Postby bobbo_the_Pragmatist » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:34 am

mirror93 wrote: I change my thinking and ideas every minute, it just comes

No progress/insight reached at all then huh? Not on the path of the Buddha for sure. btw: "it" isn't something to prove, but rather something to appreciate. Appreciate everything you can.........then pull out a plum.
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Re: The opening post is unsure.

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:48 am

Matthew Ellard wrote: May I suggest you actually work out your deep and meaningful philosophy first.....before posting it on a skeptic forum and then editing it numerous times because you aren't sure what it actually is.
mirror93 wrote: I change my thinking and ideas every minute, it just comes


I see......the philosophy of the ever changing random word generator. How useful. :D

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Poodle » Tue Aug 08, 2017 6:50 am

I change my mind all the time. Well, not ALL the time - just sometimes. If there's time. Or not. It's like there's no time like the present and I like presents.

EDIT: I may edit this.

EDIT2: Oh, I already did. Now I'm totally confused. Man.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Tue Aug 08, 2017 9:00 am

mirror93 wrote:The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts you can possibly have....

I know that I have thoughts of which I am unaware. I often seek them out to become aware of them. If they did not exist, I would not find them, but I do find them which means they existed before I was aware of them.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Phoenix76 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 9:43 am

Gord said -

I know that I have thoughts of which I am unaware. I often seek them out to become aware of them. If they did not exist, I would not find them, but I do find them which means they existed before I was aware of them.


Shoot Gord, now I'm more confused than ever, and that's saying something.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Nikki Nyx » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:50 pm

mirror93 wrote:If you make yourself believe that life is a dream and that NO person is aware of that this is a dream, like in a dream, and that they're all just maya in, and of, Consciousness. You will have the feeling that It's Consciousness that is aware and conscious. And that we are consciousness itself, and that there is no other and nothing else. The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts you can possibly have, you can't prove others have their own thoughts without the interference of consciousness.... In this view, there is only consciousness...
(Edited)

The most amazing thing about this post is that you edited it seven times...and it still makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. It's one of the most fantastic examples of word salad I've read, and should be used by the OED to illustrate the word "logorrhea."
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:47 am

Phoenix76 wrote:Gord said -

I know that I have thoughts of which I am unaware. I often seek them out to become aware of them. If they did not exist, I would not find them, but I do find them which means they existed before I was aware of them.


Shoot Gord, now I'm more confused than ever, and that's saying something.

People call it "insight" or their "muse" or "sudden inspiration".

Sometimes, for instance, I'll be thinking of two things at once, like adding up my change while wondering where my housekeys are. I'll let my "other" thoughts take care of one task while I concentrate on the other. When I "turn back" to see what my "other" thoughts have come up with, sometimes I'm surprised at the results. (Usually that's because the results are way out of whack -- like my loose change adds up to $20, which it clearly doesn't, or I think I've left my housekeys at the zoo, but that was actually something I did once 35 years earlier.)

There are probably much better examples, but my "other" thoughts didn't come up with anything while I was eating this piece of cake (breakfast cake!) so I just used those ones.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Phoenix76 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:59 am

Fair enough Gord, but sometimes I think our speak is to convoluted. I think maybe we should speak in simpler terms sometimes. I generally understand wher people are coming from, but know and then the language can be confusing.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:56 pm

Yes, Engrish is totes hard. That's why, when face to face, I prefer to communicate through interpretive dance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbuluDBHpfQ
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Aztexan » Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:09 pm

Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Dimebag » Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:58 pm

Aztexan wrote:Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.

The modern day version of, "I refute it thus".

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby placid » Sat Aug 12, 2017 2:03 pm

Aztexan wrote:Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.


Life is not an illusion or a dream, but is likened to a dream like illusion because life is basically living itself all alone.

The main illusion that seems to be very persistent is that there is an experiencer of life. The example of pain for instance, yes, pain is real enough, but the experiencer of pain or even the pain itself has no known source that can be pinned down or captured. The one experiencing pain can't be found anywhere, therefore, reality is likened to a dream or illusion.

The illusion is so convincingly real though. The funniest part of the dream is watching the phantoms take their roles very seriously as if life was actually happening to them personally as if there was an actual real person living inside that body.

When in truth..It was not I who lived, but life rather that lived me . http://img.picturequotes.com/2/584/5831 ... uote-1.jpg
There is nobody in a body.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby placid » Sat Aug 12, 2017 2:09 pm

Everything is the dream-state and has no more validity than last night's dream. Unfortunately, we identify with the dream and its concepts, so what makes you think that you're awake now? In the deep sleep state nothing exists; no planet, no galaxy, no universe!
As Kabir wrote: Between the Conscious and the Unconscious, there mind hath made a swing and on that swing hang all beings and all things, all swing.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Nikki Nyx » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:11 pm

Aztexan wrote:Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.
Even missing the organs in question, this experience is also painful for women. I discovered this decades ago when riding my (men's) ten-speed bicycle. I chanced to hit a rock in the road, which knocked me off the seat and onto the crossbar...then fell to the ground in shock at the pain. It's probably not as painful, but I would definitely go out of my way to avoid it. :blink:
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Matthew Ellard » Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:07 am

placid wrote:Everything is the dream-state and has no more validity than last night's dream. .
OK . So as this post is a day old we do not need to read it.

Thanks.


Well I guess there is no point in you posting here any more.......by your own logic..... :D

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:25 am

placid wrote:Everything is the dream-state and has no more validity than last night's dream. Unfortunately, we identify with the dream and its concepts, so what makes you think that you're awake now? In the deep sleep state nothing exists; no planet, no galaxy, no universe!

You don't believe this, otherwise you would not get out of bed in the morning, you would not eat, you would not step out of the way of oncoming traffic, and therefore you would not be posting on a message board.

As Kabir wrote: Between the Conscious and the Unconscious, there mind hath made a swing and on that swing hang all beings and all things, all swing.

As Judge Judy said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=871-3XMhtAk
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby placid » Sun Aug 13, 2017 11:52 am

Gord wrote:You don't believe this, otherwise you would not get out of bed in the morning, you would not eat, you would not step out of the way of oncoming traffic, and therefore you would not be posting on a message board.


There is no someone separate from the dream.
The mirror of life will always show you what you don't know you are doing.


"Anything that is observed in the physical universe is exactly compatible with the life form that is observing it."

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Sun Aug 13, 2017 11:34 pm

placid wrote:
Gord wrote:You don't believe this, otherwise you would not get out of bed in the morning, you would not eat, you would not step out of the way of oncoming traffic, and therefore you would not be posting on a message board.

There is no someone separate from the dream.
The mirror of life will always show you what you don't know you are doing.

In other words, "derpa derpa derp".

"Anything that is observed in the physical universe is exactly compatible with the life form that is observing it."

"The unpredictable arises and subsides in descriptions of mortality."
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Matthew Ellard » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:08 am

placid wrote:There is no someone separate from the dream. The mirror of life will always show you what you don't know you are doing. "Anything that is observed in the physical universe is exactly compatible with the life form that is observing it."


Hang on? Yesterday you said your posts were useless, as we make up our own reality.

So why are you still here posting, if you told us to ignore you? Don't you believe your own philosophical crap?
:lol:

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:14 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
placid wrote:There is no someone separate from the dream. The mirror of life will always show you what you don't know you are doing. "Anything that is observed in the physical universe is exactly compatible with the life form that is observing it."


Hang on? Yesterday you said your posts were useless, as we make up our own reality.

So why are you still here posting, if you told us to ignore you? Don't you believe your own philosophical crap?
:lol:

That's what I said! Placid's actions do not match his claims.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Matthew Ellard » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:37 am

Gord wrote: That's what I said! Placid's actions do not match his claims.
Placid and Shaka are just hypocritical idiots. They keep posting here telling us to ignore them, as they aren't real. :lol:

They really should go post their idiotic "advice" somewhere else.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby scrmbldggs » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:18 am

Gord wrote:
placid wrote:<the usual>

You don't believe this, otherwise you would not get out of bed in the morning, you would not eat, you would not step out of the way of oncoming traffic, and therefore you would not be posting on a message board.

But it's more noble when placid does it.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby placid » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:28 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
Gord wrote: That's what I said! Placid's actions do not match his claims.
Placid and Shaka are just hypocritical idiots. They keep posting here telling us to ignore them, as they aren't real. :lol:


Only an idiot believes a recording is real. A recording is not biology, anything that comes out of the biological brain is a recording. Who you are is right here sitting at the very edge of life not knowing what is going to happen next. The brain is the recorder replaying the event after the event is over. Recordings are not real, biology is.

Matthew Ellard wrote:They really should go post their idiotic "advice" somewhere else.

There is only here.

Here is where nothing happens, where no one watches nothing happening.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gord » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:53 am

placid wrote:Only an idiot believes a recording is real.

Recordings are real.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Confidencia » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:22 am

Gord wrote:
mirror93 wrote:The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts you can possibly have....

I know that I have thoughts of which I am unaware. I often seek them out to become aware of them. If they did not exist, I would not find them, but I do find them which means they existed before I was aware of them.


Of course Gord , the mental process goes on even when you are not there. They are not your thoughts exclusively it is just a pool of thought, better still consciousness.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Confidencia » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:50 am

mirror93 wrote:If you make yourself believe that life is a dream and that NO person is aware of that this is a dream, like in a dream, and that they're all just maya in, and of, Consciousness. You will have the feeling that It's Consciousness that is aware and conscious. And that we are consciousness itself, and that there is no other and nothing else. The thoughts that You are aware of right now are the only thoughts you can possibly have, you can't prove others have their own thoughts without the interference of consciousness.... In this view, there is only consciousness...
(Edited)


You are already in that state of make believe. Consciousness itself is dreamlike. You may have well have said let's dream about dreaming. The waking state is one of ignorance and in it you dream about life before death and you dream about life after death. It is a never ending cycle that continues until you wake up.

If you are aware that you are conscious rather than just being aware of your thoughts and feelings then the process has already begun. Suddenly you will find yourself beyond the consciousness and in full awareness. You will be aware of being aware. Unlike the ignorant ones who are not even aware of their present state nevermind their condition in consciousness.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Confidencia » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:07 am

Aztexan wrote:Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.


There is feeling, who is feeling and what is being felt you do not know. If you are ignorant you will say I am feeling the kick to my balls. Now it is fine if you want to stick to this world view but it merely shows that you have not understood your current position.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Gawdzilla Sama » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:12 am

Mirro, this reflects poorly on you.
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Confidencia » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:33 am

Matthew Ellard wrote:
placid wrote:There is no someone separate from the dream. The mirror of life will always show you what you don't know you are doing. "Anything that is observed in the physical universe is exactly compatible with the life form that is observing it."
:senile: my name is ellard, the textbook massive.


How can the real be compatible with the unreal? If that was the case there would be no conflict, the two are diametrical opposed. To this end you cannot know the observer. Only the observed and the process of observation. You are the observer but you are not in the picture, hence the reason why you can observe the picture in its entirety. It is this fact which sets you apart from the dream.

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Confidencia » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:27 pm

placid wrote:
Aztexan wrote:Anyone who says we are living a dream or a simulation or an illusion ain't never been kicked right square in the balls.


Life is not an illusion or a dream, but is likened to a dream like illusion because life is basically living itself all alone.


Life as we know it is a dream.

The main illusion that seems to be very persistent is that there is an experiencer of life. The example of pain for instance, yes, pain is real enough, but the experiencer of pain or even the pain itself has no known source that can be pinned down or captured. The one experiencing pain can't be found anywhere, therefore, reality is likened to a dream or illusion.


Pain is real enough for there to be feeling but it is not real in the absolute. Pain is part of a biological system which is part of a world, which is part of a universe. In your deep sleep do you know of any universe?

If I do not know pleasure then I cannot know pain. What have I got to gauge the level and intensity of pain if there is no pleasure to go by?

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby Matthew Ellard » Tue Aug 15, 2017 12:19 am

Confidencia wrote: If you are ignorant you will say I am feeling the kick to my balls.
Who did you pay to kick you in the balls?

Did you go to a bondage & discipline place for that or just read one of your forum posts to a stranger?
:D

Confidencia wrote:Pain is real enough for there to be feeling but it is not real in the absolute
Perhaps you just have very small balls. :D

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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby placid » Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:54 am

Matthew Ellard wrote: Perhaps you just have very small balls. :D


No, it's just that some people have only got golf ball sized consciousnesses.

When you make yourself a ''thing'' you become very small.

https://28oa9i1t08037ue3m1l0i861-wpengi ... /Thing.png



Who you really are is Everything and Nothing.

Pain arises, but no ''thing'' ever felt pain. There's just pain, paining. Or if you want to be more scientific, brain braining.

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mirror93
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Re: Imagine as if this was a dream

Postby mirror93 » Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:08 am

placid wrote:
Matthew Ellard wrote: Perhaps you just have very small balls. :D


No, it's just that some people have only got golf ball sized consciousnesses.

When you make yourself a ''thing'' you become very small.

https://28oa9i1t08037ue3m1l0i861-wpengi ... /Thing.png



Who you really are is Everything and Nothing.

Pain arises, but no ''thing'' ever felt pain. There's just pain, paining. Or if you want to be more scientific, brain braining.


I like to post philosophical nonsense on internet, but when I'm serious, I'm serious, and your posts seems that you are talking serious and this is worrisome

define "everything", define "nothing"

without the proper definition, you cannot define yourself as 'everything', how can you be everything when you are a subject? an individual? what is it like to be everything? do you believe in god? omniscience? do you know everything that there is to know? If so, prove, with evidence.

And no one define themselves as a "thing", I'm not a "thing", my computer can be called a "thing", I'm a 'subject', not an 'object'. And for 'me' to be alive and a subject, conscious of my enviroment and of 'myself', requires an object (brain), which itself is a 'thing', and my brain is PART of we know as "everything", aka, the universe, how can my brain, which gives me consciousness can be "everything or nothing"? that's not even wrong, it's absurd.

and what do you mean by "brain braining"? that's utterly nonsense, you are trying to avoid the 'subject' who feel the pain and think his thoughts, but you make no sense.

and yes, it was R. S. Thomas who lived, and who died, and who wrote that line, not "life", "life" is a concept, it isn't any "thing"

ie, what placid is denying is what is experiencing now and is typing now.


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